VERMONT: Liberal Episcopal Bishop Pushes Gay Marriage Equality
Testimony from the Right Reverend Thomas C. Ely, Episcopal Bishop of Vermont before the Vermont Commission on Family Recognition and Protection
http://www.dioceseofvermont.org/Elyletters/ElyLetters07/ElyVCFRPDec07.html
December 18, 2007
My name is Thomas Ely. I live in Burlington and serve as Bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Vermont. I have been happily married to Ann for 31 years and tonight I want to offer a brief word in support of civil marriage equality for all Vermonters.
As a person of faith, my religious convictions have led me to speak out for human and civil rights in a broad range of areas over the years.
The Episcopal Church's General Convention in resolution after resolution has, since 1976, consistently expressed its conviction that homosexual persons are entitled to equal protection of the laws with all other citizens, and it has called upon our society to see that such protection is provided in actuality. I am here tonight in response to those resolutions and the Baptismal Covenant of The Episcopal Church, and the compelling case they make for people of faith to respect and work for the dignity of every human being.
The state has a compelling interest in providing equality in the matter of civil rights to all people. The provision for Civil Unions in Vermont was a positive step in assuring that those civil rights that automatically extend to married couples also extend to gay and lesbian couples.
But the aim with Civil Unions was a separate but equal status. In the reality of our having lived with Civil Unions in Vermont for seven years now, we know that as was true with school segregation, so too with Civil Unions and Civil Marriage: separate is not equal.
Discrimination does continue, and while making provision for marriage equality for all couples here in Vermont will not end the discrimination against gay and lesbian couples in other states and in the federal laws, it will be an important step in the right direction.
The other point I want to emphasize tonight is that providing the civil right of civil marriage to heterosexual and homosexual couples alike would not compel any religious community to perform marriages of same-sex couples.
The state allows ordained clergy and certain other designated religious persons to act as agents of the state with regard to civil marriage, but no clergyperson is required by the state to do so.
Different religious communities have different theological views on the subject of matrimony. The privilege and religious freedom to express and act upon those convictions is not compromised by the state providing civil marriage and the subsequent civil rights of marriage to all couples. It is my conviction that the church can and should support civil marriage for all - even if, at this time we are not of one mind about the church's involvement in these ceremonies.
To date, 31 Episcopal Clergy are among the many religious leaders who have signed the Vermont Declaration of Religious Support for the Freedom of Same-Gender Couples to Marry. They have done so, knowing full well that the Canons of the Episcopal Church will need to change before they could preside at such weddings for same sex couples. While currently, they can preside at Civil Union ceremonies, they recognize as do I, that being "unioned" or "partnered" is not the same as being "married."
I hope the work of this Commission will help Vermonters understand that reality and give encouragement to our state legislature to make civil marriage possible for all couples.
END
| Poster | Thread |
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| yendor | Posted: 2008/12/29 13:31 Updated: 2008/12/29 13:31 |
Just can't stay away ![]() ![]() Joined: 2007/11/3 From: Posts: 87 |
Quote:
I want to offer a brief word in support of civil marriage equality for all Vermonters. This is really nonsense : marriage equality already exists - but like genders can no more be 'married' than I can 'marry' my pet dog. |
| webb2k | Posted: 2008/12/29 13:38 Updated: 2008/12/29 13:38 |
Just can't stay away ![]() ![]() Joined: 2007/3/23 From: MISSOURAH!!! Posts: 103 |
I'll bet California is working on that!
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| jfmckenna | Posted: 2008/12/29 13:45 Updated: 2008/12/29 13:45 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2006/2/4 From: Posts: 584 |
Marriage equality is an oxymoron. Marriage is a system of privilege and preference to support the reality that society needs the maximum number of its members to grow up with both a father and a mother. Compare it to the system of veterans benefits. That's also a system of privileges and preferences. What if, for the sake of a noble-sounding concept like "equality" the same privileges and benefits became available to nonveterans? It destroys the concept.
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| Cennydd | Posted: 2008/12/29 13:53 Updated: 2008/12/29 13:53 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
I would hope that this commission ignores this bishop's words.
Cennydd |
| patulous | Posted: 2008/12/29 14:58 Updated: 2008/12/29 14:58 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2007/5/18 From: Posts: 1778 |
Quote: "They have done so, knowing full well that the Canons of the Episcopal Church will need to change before they could preside at such weddings for same sex couples."
Just tell schoria and she will change it with the stroke of a pen. I still don't get it when the subject of marriages comes up......why is it that the pansexual group think that it is being equal to allow two men or two women to go through a ceremony that still is not accepted as marriage. As I said before, TEC bishops are mentally ill and think that they don't have to worry about God. This smacks of disbelief in God Himself and makes the bishops think that they are the ones that have the power to change what the church believes. TEC has thrown away the Bible and doesn't want to worry about what it says. As I said before Scripture and Tradition have disappeared from the TEC churches and only "reason" remains. They reason, and reason, and reason, then they start the homosexual marriage garbage in another state in the U.S. when they fail, as in California. Vermont: Stand your ground, or have all your leaders as pansexuals and the courts full of discrimination lawsuits. |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2008/12/29 17:30 Updated: 2008/12/29 17:32 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
Webb2k, not every Californian is a certified mental case.
Remember, San Francisco....even with its large and unfortunately vocal LBGT community....did not vote against Proposition 8, and their vote was in favor of it. Russell and Company didn't like that, and they're raising hell about it now. They will lose....again! Cennydd |
| Drummie | Posted: 2008/12/29 17:35 Updated: 2008/12/29 17:35 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2007/9/27 From: Posts: 512 |
This so called bishop denies the God of his fathers and is not worthy of the title of bishop. He is a liar. Marriage is between a man and a woman, and the state has an important interest in promoting health and safety. You can not do that by legislation that promotes sin.
Yes, I am judgemental. An ordained minister in the Church of God of any degree is a liar and blasphemous fool when he publically or privately supports what God calls an abomination and is not worthy to be a respected member of his order. Yes that includes you VGR and KJS. |
| otispage2 | Posted: 2008/12/29 18:46 Updated: 2008/12/29 18:50 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2007/3/14 From: Posts: 615 |
The slogan of the pro homosexual activists here in California is “equality”, meaning they insist that same-sex marriages should be the same as traditional marriage between a man and a woman.
Why is this slogan aggressively pushed by the homosexuals? It is not for the seeking of “equality”! That is the buzz-word for a larger “agenda”! It is to undermine traditional teachings, the fundamental precept in Scripture in all religions, that marriage is between a man and a woman. It is to disparage, in the Christian context, the absolute teaching in Scripture that acts of same-sex sexual relationships are wrong and sinful. (Rom. 1:26, 27, Lev. 18:22, 20:13, 1 Cor. 6:9, 1 Tim. 1:10, Gen. 19: 1-9, Judg. 19:22, 1 Kin. 14:24 and Jude 7). It is to support the homosexual agenda in the secular domain to undermine religious and secular practices that marriage is between a man and a woman. It is to politically and legally assert that homosexuals as a Constitutional "minority" are discriminated against because they do not have the same civil right given men and women – who marry with the intention and traditional right to propagate family and children. It is to establish teachings to children and young adults that homosexuality – in all of its applications – are normal and must be taught in schools. That same-sex sexual acts – along with promiscuous sexual conduct (especially oral sex) – is approved by secular authority! No, homosexuals are not seeking “equality”. They seek a revolution that undermines the morality of sexual relationships. There is no ethic here, only a debauchery condemned and scorned through ages past. |
| Statmann | Posted: 2008/12/29 20:02 Updated: 2008/12/29 20:02 |
Just can't stay away ![]() ![]() Joined: 2008/11/20 From: Posts: 109 |
The Diocese of Vermont from 2002 through 2007 lost 10 percent of its membership, 13 percent of its ASA and still managed to increase Plate & Pledge by a bit over inflation. In 2007 they had 124 Infant Baptisms and 186 Burials which labels them as an aging diocese. Being from the Midwest I have no idea of the New England psyche, but they must be a trusting lot to follow Bishop Ely. Statmann
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| jfmckenna | Posted: 2008/12/29 21:50 Updated: 2008/12/29 21:50 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2006/2/4 From: Posts: 584 |
This is a bogus benevolence. The Rt. Rev. William Wantland, former Episcopal Bishop of Eau Claire had this to say: "First, I am deeply disturbed by the action of a number of heterophobic bigots, who encourage homosexuals to engage in a practice which is cruel and deadly. 91% of all male homosexuals engage in anal sodomy. Regular practice of anal sodomy will shorten human life an average of 26 years, even without factoring in AIDS. These people, purporting to act in the name of the Church, are as evil as those who would give whiskey to alcoholics. What 815 2nd Ave. (the national church's headquarters in New York City) is urging is death on a grand scale, and calling it care and support of their victims, without any regard for what they are doing. Don't ever say that TEC cares for or loves its homosexual members."
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| Cennydd | Posted: 2008/12/30 1:25 Updated: 2008/12/30 1:25 |
Home away from home ![]() ![]() Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
How many times have non-celibate lesbians and homosexuals been warned about the health risks of unnatural sex acts? I'd venture to say thousands of times! Yet they continue to indulge in this death-dealing behavior!
The only part of TEC that claims to "love" its homosexual members is the LBGT cabal who seized control of the Church and which is actively promoting this immoral lifestyle. Cennydd |















