VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers
By Michelle Zimmermann
Times Community Newspapers
http://tinyurl.com/2jtqwq
8/7/2007
Several local ministers who have been removed from the rosters of the clergy by the Episcopal Church are calling the move an uncalled-for act of intimidation.
Clergy members of several area churches that voted late last year to separate from the Episcopal Church were effectively "fired" late last week by Bishop James Lee of the Diocese of Virginia. A statement on the diocese's Web site states that the decision was made to depose the clergy because they "had abandoned the communion of the Episcopal Church."
Clergy members said the move is meaningless. When the assortment of 11 churches voted to leave the Episcopal Church late last year, they aligned themselves with the Anglican District of Virginia (ADV). That group is a member of the Convocation of Anglicans in North America (CANA), the missionary arm of the Anglican Church of Nigeria.
"I'm saddened by Bishop Lee's unnecessary action," said Rick Wright, rector of The Falls Church in the town of the same name. "It demonstrates not only the division in the diocese between us and them, but between the Episcopal Church and Anglican community."
Jim Oakes, vice president of ADV, echoed Wright's comments, saying it seemed the diocese was following a "scorched-earth policy."
Diocesan spokesman Patrick Getlein said the move was merely procedural, as the churches' decision to leave the Episcopal Church set in motion a six-month process. At the end of this process, if the clergy in question have not retracted their decision to leave the church, they are removed from ordained minister status.
"They were priests of the Episcopal Church," Getlein said. To align with something other than the Episcopal Church would mean they are no longer priests of that denomination, he added.
The entire dispute stems from a decision by the Episcopal Church to ordain a homosexual bishop in 2003. Oakes said member churches voted to leave the Episcopal Church to stay true to their orthodox priorities.
"Bishop Lee could have taken another course, and could have recognized the reality of what's occurring in the church," said Jack Grubbs, pastor of Potomac Falls Church in Sterling. "This action has no practical impact on our ministry."
Though the group of 21 clergy members says the action has no effect on their ministries, what it may affect is pension funds of those nearing retirement. The traditional retirement plan to which ministers contribute only allows full disbursement upon reaching 30 years with the church. What has already been saved, though, is still available, according to Getlein.
Wright said several on the cusp of that threshold stand to lose a great deal.
"For a few of the clergy, it has a significant consequence," he said.
Again, Getlein said those consequences should have come as no surprise to the clergy in question.
"Bishop Lee made it clear to them, the potential outcomes of their decision," Getlein said. "This is not new information."
END
| Poster | Thread |
|---|---|
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/8/7 18:51 Updated: 2007/8/7 18:53 |
Home away from home   Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6788 |
 Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministersMr Getlein is right when he says this is "not new information." What he didn't say is that this action is meaningless and a complete waste of time and effort. It is also extremely vindictive, spiteful, and unnecessary. The bishop might just as well have been "preaching to the choir," for all the good it did!
Of course, then one could assume that by deposing priests who had already left, he's warning others not to "abandon communion with The Episcopal Church," or he'll do the same to them. I am quite sure that those faithful Christian priests won't be the last to leave....no matter HOW much Bishop Lee threatens those who oppose him! Cennydd |
| Fisherman | Posted: 2007/8/7 19:17 Updated: 2007/8/7 19:17 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2006/8/25 From: Dallas - Province of the Southern Cone, DoFW Posts: 675 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Wait for the Lord, and keep to his way, and he will exalt you to possess the land; you will look on the destruction of the wicked.
Mark the blameless man, and behold the upright, for there is posterity for the man of peace. But transgressors shall be altogether destroyed; the posterity of the wicked shall be cut off. (Psalm 37:34,37-38) |
| Pirate | Posted: 2007/8/7 19:56 Updated: 2007/8/7 19:56 |
Just can't stay away   Joined: 2004/3/19 From: Diocese of Atlanta Posts: 115 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers With the multiplicity of Christian denominations and the rise of large nondenominational churches, a bishop really has no authority other than to say essentially that another clergyman can no longer play in his yard. Any clergyman worth his salt can find another church. In the south, we sometimes see moves from Episcopal to Baptist, Presbyterian or Methodist and vice versa. The clergyman still has a pulpit and an altar and a congregation.
The bishops can't seem to understand that neither their clergy nor most of their parishioners really care what they think any more. This is probably why they are attempting gain relevancy through deposing clergy with whom they disagree and using the court system as a weopon against their flocks. When will they figure out that it's not working? |
| btaylor | Posted: 2007/8/7 20:49 Updated: 2007/8/7 20:49 |
Quite a regular  Joined: 2006/6/26 From: California Posts: 65 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers I am not saddened. I am amused. Bishop Lee's response is an act of impotence. It illustrates just how toothless TEc really is. They have power only as long as they possess something we want. When we quit wanting anything they have, they become totally powerless and impotent. Bishop Lee and all the rest of the TEc leadership have given me a lot of good belly laughs recently. Talk about sound and fury...
 |
| frjude | Posted: 2007/8/7 21:14 Updated: 2007/8/7 21:14 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/1/9 From: Heartland Posts: 277 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers NEWSFLASH! A DEPOSITION IS COMING!
Revelation 21:8 ESV But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable...and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death." |
| Ikerliker | Posted: 2007/8/7 22:00 Updated: 2007/8/7 22:00 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2007/1/16 From: PA Posts: 2046 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Please don't tell me anyone was surprised by this.
As For the deposed, they should wear it as a badge of honor! |
| Shane | Posted: 2007/8/8 1:10 Updated: 2007/8/8 1:14 |
Not too shy to talk  Joined: 2007/8/8 From: Posts: 23 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers The question I have when thinking about being unfit for ministry is why is it that Peter Lee takes his name out of PB races--I think twice now.
The rumor is there is something in his history, or even current affairs, that he doesn't want to come out.
|
| Shane | Posted: 2007/8/8 1:16 Updated: 2007/8/8 1:16 |
Not too shy to talk Joined: 2007/8/8 From: Posts: 23 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers I heard it had something to do with his limo drivers...
|
| Fisherman | Posted: 2007/8/8 1:58 Updated: 2007/8/8 1:58 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/8/25 From: Dallas - Province of the Southern Cone, DoFW Posts: 675 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Inquiring minds would like to hear any theories. One never knows what might turn up following a good lead.
|
| ZachD | Posted: 2007/8/8 4:09 Updated: 2007/8/8 4:09 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/11/10 From: Posts: 1784 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Hmmm,
Anyone hear anything about the virtue of gossip? From the Wisdom of Solomon: "Gossip is so tasty. How we love to swallow it!" |
| Newshound | Posted: 2007/8/8 13:44 Updated: 2007/8/8 13:45 |
Home away from home Joined: 2007/5/5 From: Posts: 236 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers My Episcopal career (1978-1997), was in the Diocese of Virginia.
Things continue to get more to the left. I'm surprised.. at the amount of liberalism that seems to come out of the southern states such as the ongoing controversy generated from Richmond and the University of the South, I thought all these guys were confederate, conservative and proper gentlemen.  |
| Shane | Posted: 2007/8/8 15:22 Updated: 2007/8/8 15:22 |
Not too shy to talk Joined: 2007/8/8 From: Posts: 23 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Griswold and Shaw, O'Neill and Kearon, Gullick and Schudig, Lee and his Limo drivers?
|
| servant | Posted: 2007/8/8 15:32 Updated: 2007/8/8 15:32 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2006/10/3 From: Dallas, Texas Posts: 191 |
Another slap in the face of the Anglican Communion To depose a clergyman who is a priest in good standing within the Anglican Communion is yet another slap in the face of the Communion.
While it may seem somewhat meaningless, it actually has a lot of meaning. It speaks volumes about the continued arrogance of TEC, and it's yet demonstration of unchristian behavior by a TEC bishop. This action should also remind other churches within the Anglican Communion just how little value TEC places on its "communion" with the rest of the Communion. |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/8/8 17:00 Updated: 2007/8/8 19:44 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6788 |
Re: Another slap in the face of the Anglican Communion And the heretics say they want to stay in the Communion? Yeah, they'd like to stay, alright....they want to run it!
And if they can't, then they're ready to "take all of their marbles and go home"....to start their own "Episcopal Communion" with the 15 overseas "churches" that they dominate with their ill-gotten money. That's their game plan. They are so "transparent!" Why else would Trinity Church in NYC....the "richest church in the world"....hold a Love-In in Spain to try to lure African churches into TEC's orbit? They're SCARED, people! Scared of what we so-called "schismatics" are doing, and it terrifies them! It threatens their much-prized hegemony, and that's why they're lashing out with such frenzied vengeance against faithful Christians! Cennydd |
| ckelly6373 | Posted: 2007/8/8 19:46 Updated: 2007/8/8 19:47 |
Just can't stay away  Joined: 2007/2/14 From: Posts: 89 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Quote:
Clergy members said the move is meaningless. I think the only people who are seriously offended by this are TEC. Sounds like the priests have moved on. TEC is like a whiny old ex-girlfriend/boyfriend begging for you to come back after you got married. "Why don't you love me anymore?" Things change and it's not going to happen! They are so deluded and full of vanity. |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/8/8 23:19 Updated: 2007/8/9 15:48 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6788 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Quote:
Why don't you love me anymore? This reminds me of Hank Williams' tune "Why don't you love me like you used to do, why do you treat me like a worn-out shoe?" TEC is a "worn-out shoe".....among other things! Cennydd |
| Sodslaw | Posted: 2007/8/9 1:50 Updated: 2007/8/9 1:51 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2007/8/3 From: Orthodox Bunker Posts: 340 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Cennydd,
Spot on! You know I once asked an air force officer whether he felt important when dressed in his uniform and walking out in public. He said "most people probably think I am a bus driver and they don't really care what I do or who I am!" Dear Dear Peter, you have no authority over these men, and we don't care who you think you are, or how you are dressed. God is going to judge you for your spiritual abuse of these godly men and He is bigger than you. We are but dust............... |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/8/9 15:57 Updated: 2007/8/9 15:57 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6788 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church deposes separation ministers Sodslaw, you're right about +Lee. He will be nothing more than a tiny insignificant speck on humanity's page, yet we can be sure that he's BIG on God's radar screen....and He WILL deal with him....mark my words!
 Cennydd |
