News : VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers of Breakaway Va. Churches
VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church Seeks to Sue Unpaid Volunteers of Breakaway Virginia Churches
CR DailyOnline
http://www.thecronline.com/news_article.php?nid=2713&ndate=02/07/2007
July 2, 2007
The Episcopal Church and the Diocese of Virginia are seeking to add more unpaid volunteers to the list of defendants in the case against 11 breakaway Virginia churches. If the Episcopal Church is granted this motion it would automatically add 76 additional unpaid church volunteers to the lawsuit and anyone else who might volunteer to serve as a Vestry member or Trustee of any of the local churches in the future.
Counsel for the 11 churches filed a memo opposing the denomination's motions to add more volunteer trustees and lay leaders (known as "vestry member") as defendants in the lawsuit. Currently, the lawsuit includes rectors, vestries and, in comes cases, trustees.
Jim Oakes: "We remind The Episcopal Church and the Diocese that these unpaid volunteer Vestry members and Trustees have made no individual claims to the church property, and Virginia law grants complete immunity from civil liability to those who serve religious organizations without pay.
The Episcopal Church and the Diocese have already sued almost 100 unpaid church volunteers who are immune from being sued, and now they want to add more. It is unfortunate that they feel the need to involve these volunteers in the court battle when they have nothing to gain by doing so," said Jim Oakes, vice-chairman of the Anglican District of Virginia (ADV), an association of Anglican congregations in Virginia and a part of the Convocation of Anglicans in North America (CANA).
All 11 churches named in the lawsuit are members of ADV.
"At the core of this case is that The Episcopal Church and the Diocese claim they have a 'trust' interest in the congregations' properties," continued Oakes. "But the Virginia courts have held time and again that denominations cannot claim an 'implied trust' in member congregations' property.
The Episcopal Church even admitted in its complaint that it does not hold title to any of these eleven churches and that the churches' own trustees hold title for the benefit of the congregations."
Oakes doesn't understand why the Episcopal Church and the Diocese wants to add more individuals to the lawsuit.
"It is hard to understand The Episcopal Church's and the Diocese's motivation for attacking these volunteers and our churches. The motivation appears to be intimidation, but we remain open to negotiating a reasonable solution. We are simply remaining steadfast in our faith and have chosen to stay in the worldwide Anglican Communion."
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| Poster | Thread |
|---|---|
| morrismpls | Posted: 2007/7/3 1:12 Updated: 2007/7/3 1:12 |
Home away from home   Joined: 2004/1/4 From: Posts: 496 |
 Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o...Now THAT'S waging reconciliation!
The beatings will continue until morale improves. |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/7/3 1:29 Updated: 2007/7/3 1:29 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Now they've gone too damned far!! This proves what a petty bunch of rotten, no-good thieves they are, and they deserve the damnation of everyone from pew-sitter to primate! What a disgusting bunch of so-called Christians they are!
They want to sue someone, do they? FINE! Let 'em sue ME for having the nerve to call 'em as I see 'em: Liars, heretics, and everything else too numerous to mention!  Cennydd |
| daveball | Posted: 2007/7/3 1:30 Updated: 2007/7/3 1:30 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2004/12/18 From: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 2377 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Words like "disgusting", "despicable", "slimy" and "mean spirited" don't begin to describe the "Prophets of Reconciliation". In fact, using those words to describe the sub-human sludge residing at 815 does a great disservice to the honestly disgusting,despicable, slimy and mean spirited persons of this world.
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| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/7/3 1:44 Updated: 2007/7/3 1:44 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... "Sub-human sludge" is a fitting term to describe these so-called "Christians." There isn't one single thing "Christian" about ANY of them!
Cennydd |
| RalphM | Posted: 2007/7/3 2:37 Updated: 2007/7/3 2:37 |
Just can't stay away   Joined: 2004/12/13 From: Posts: 77 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... You are all more angry than those of us named in the suits. The righteous indignation is appreciated, however.
RalphM |
| Leonardori | Posted: 2007/7/3 4:00 Updated: 2007/7/3 4:00 |
Not too shy to talk  Joined: 2007/6/26 From: Posts: 37 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Oh my Cennydd,
Somehow I think and feel we must be viewing people who aren't Christian...how could this be? I know you and I both feel strongly about people being treated honorably and lovingly, yet, somehow we have been "let down" by mean spirited folks who would harm others. How can we love people that mean to hurt us and cast us out? No wonder you're disgusted. I've been disgusted just like you. Peace be with you as you and I face the realities of GODS unrelenting TRUTH that will pass before us at The Body of Christ. |
| Fisherman | Posted: 2007/7/3 7:40 Updated: 2007/7/3 7:49 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2006/8/25 From: Dallas - Province of the Southern Cone, DoFW Posts: 675 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Wikipedia: “Legal harassment - Legal actions against an individual or a group, for example SLAPP suits.” “A Strategic Lawsuit Against Public Participation ("SLAPP") is a form of litigation filed by a large organization or in some cases an individual plaintiff, to intimidate and silence a less powerful critic by so severely burdening them with the cost of a legal defense that they abandon their criticism." "One marker of a SLAPP suit is whether the costs outweigh the claimed damages by a large amount, for instance, damages of a few hundred dollars and costs in the tens of thousands. Lawyers are thought to be particularly conflicted in SLAPP suits, since a marginal case can lead to high legal charges, and they are encouraged to run up costs by their clients.”
The Bible: Luke 11:46 "And [Jesus] said, "Woe to you lawyers also! for you load men with burdens hard to bear, and you yourselves do not touch the burdens with one of your fingers." |
| JimMcNeely | Posted: 2007/7/3 11:19 Updated: 2007/7/3 11:19 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2004/4/7 From: Posts: 699 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... RalphM,
Wear it like a badge of honor. Being opposed by this bunch is like surviving an IED attack in Fallujah in the Anglican world. -Jim+ |
| Newshound | Posted: 2007/7/3 12:18 Updated: 2007/7/3 12:18 |
Home away from home Joined: 2007/5/5 From: Posts: 238 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... I live in the Northern Virginia area, and I attended Truro, Falls Church and Apostles for years. I am now at McLean Bible Church. This story is getting major play in the secular media. The only people that will suffer in the long run are the hoo-hahs running the Diocese of Virginia. There is a general attitude of shock and disbelief at Bishop Lee and his people that they will go to these extremes.
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| hmwoodiii | Posted: 2007/7/3 12:49 Updated: 2007/7/3 12:49 |
Just popping in  Joined: 2007/7/3 From: Connecticut Posts: 1 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Ralph,
Can you give me the name of the Lawyers representing the churches. I would like to get in touch with them about a similar matter. Howard |
| aspire1983 | Posted: 2007/7/3 13:20 Updated: 2007/7/3 13:20 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2004/10/12 From: FORMERLY Diocese of Virginia / Now CANA Posts: 421 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Newshound - -
Major play in the secular media? WHICH secular media? I haven't seen that much... but then, I don't get the newspaper, either. I frankly have been disappointed by how LITTLE coverage there is in the news about the new Anglican Reformation. By the way, I attended Apostles for years myself. You may have seen me there... 1982-2002. |
| esniii | Posted: 2007/7/3 13:37 Updated: 2007/7/3 13:37 |
Home away from home Joined: 2004/3/29 From: Posts: 390 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... You know, I wonder how much and what kind of information it would take to get the IRS to revoke the national episcopal church's 501(c)3 status?
If we could have them removed from the tax-exempt listing so they paid for that stolen turf they took it would only be just damages to their foul wallets. After all, they are mostly a corrupt, uncaring bunch of hypocritical bottom-feeders who strangle funds out of those who are actually doing good in their communities. Just an odd thought... |
| Newshound | Posted: 2007/7/3 13:57 Updated: 2007/7/3 13:57 |
Home away from home Joined: 2007/5/5 From: Posts: 238 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Aspire 1983,
Good to hear from you. Julia Duin at the Washington Times has done extensive coverage on this issue. The Washington Post has also run several stories. The British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC), seen on several PBS outlets has covered this as well. It is getting play in Australia and New Zealand. Just about all of the local TV stations have done a story on the split, although much of this has been reaction as opposed to tracking 40 plus years of problems. If you want the real story, the best place, of course, is David Virtue. I do agree that more coverage is needed of the Anglican Reformation and the real reasons for the split (departure from the Bible by the liberals). Hopefully things will improve |
| Cennydd | Posted: 2007/7/3 15:01 Updated: 2007/7/3 17:18 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6862 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Esniii, I'm afraid it wouldn't be easy to get the IRS to revoke their 501(c)3 status. In order to lose that status, they'd have to do something illegal, and that could be hard to prove unless IRS sends a team of their auditors in to investigate them.
From my perspective, TEC is organized like a corporation....which is what they really are. Their assets are really the property of ALL of their members....including those in the process of getting ready to leave, and those who have left....since all of us have given money to them over the years. I think, in a way, they're like ENRON, and it'll take a major Federal investigation to sort matters out, so you can bet your last buck that they'll have all of the bases covered....by their auditors, their tax people, their investment bankers (many of whom are wealthy and influential Episcopalians), and "Old Money," with all that that implies....rich people in wealthy Mainline parishes, for instance. I would truly LOVE to see TEC "taken to the cleaners," and I hope it can be done! Furthermore, I'd like nothing better than to see them tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail! They've already been exposed for the heretics, liars, thieves, frauds and charlatans that they are, and this would be the icing on the cake! Cennydd |
| Abigail | Posted: 2007/7/4 9:50 Updated: 2007/7/4 9:50 |
Just popping in Joined: 2007/6/30 From: Posts: 7 |
Re: VIRGINIA: Episcopal Church to Sue Unpaid Volunteers o... Unfortunately, going after their tax-exempt status would ultimately hurt all churches, so there would be no victory in that. But I must say this new strategy TEC has developed mystifies me. For a group that is already dwindling to take such an action seems like suicide. If this is a kingdom-building tactic, someone will have to explain to me how it works. I'm not familiar with Christ's teachings on winning through intimidation.
I can understand (but not condone) their going after the faithful shepherds. That has been going on for years. I've had the honor of knowing several godly men who were deposed a few years ago. But that was always kept at the ecclesiastical court level. Now that the snipers are aiming at both shepherd and sheep, and bringing in the power of the civil government to assist in the fleecing, the battle has reached a new and sinister level. |
| ctowles | Posted: 2007/7/4 11:37 Updated: 2007/7/4 11:37 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/12/4 From: Posts: 498 |
Au Contraire Cennydd This suit twist offers great opportunity. As a response, one might begin a class action lawsuit in return to 815's action that would require depositions of Schori and DeBeers et al. Those depositions could begin the legal casework of a national strategy. All we need is a sugar daddy to fund this or retired or enterprising pro bono attorneys who want to do God's work. Peace in Chaos.
ctowles |
| Pirate | Posted: 2007/7/5 14:27 Updated: 2007/7/5 14:27 |
Just can't stay away Joined: 2004/3/19 From: Diocese of Atlanta Posts: 115 |
Re: Au Contraire Cennydd With apologies to Tertullian:
See how those Christians sue one another! |
