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News : ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome

Posted by David Virtue on 2007/3/29 10:50:00 (4891 reads)

ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME

3/28/2007

Dear Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Upon my arrival home from the House of Bishop's meeting, I received the attached letter from Bishop Dan, informing me that after a three and half year long period of "focused prayer and study," he and Carol have decided to return to their roots and be received into full communion with the Roman Catholic Church. While I respect Bishop Dan and Carol's decision, it is with great sadness that I receive and pass on this news.

I know this was not an easy decision, nor was it made without great personal cost. Unfortunately, unlike Bishop Bena's decision to transfer to the Church of Nigeria, continuing as a bishop in good standing in the Anglican Communion, Bishop Dan's decision has necessitated the resignation of his orders as bishop, priest and deacon. As such, he will not be able to function in an ordained capacity within the Diocese or larger Anglican Communion.

Dan and Carol have been and continue to be good friends of the Diocese of Albany and will always be welcome at all functions in the Diocese. Their decision to return to Rome was not and should not be seen as an attack or lack of love or concern for the Diocese of Albany. As we continue to hold Dan and Carol up in our thoughts and prayers, may God bless them richly in His love and mercy and grace.

The recent retirement and subsequent departure of both Bishop Dan and Bishop Dave from the Episcopal Church, can't help but have a major impact on each of us and our Diocese. One of my greatest concerns, as your new Bishop, is that others in the Diocese are also struggling with the current issues that threaten to divide the Church. Please know that I am here for you as we work through these issues.

As your bishop and brother in Christ, I appreciate and give thanks to God for you and every member of our diocesan family. I need you as we move forward. We are blessed with being in a wonderful, Christ-centered, Spirit-filled Diocese. The Lord is doing mighty things in the Diocese of Albany and has even greater plans for the future. It is absolutely essential that we stick together, as one body in Christ, loving, supporting and upholding one another as we answer our Lord's call to act in faith and obedience though the power of the Holy Spirit, living the Great Commandment and Great Commission.

May our Lord Jesus Christ bless us and use us mightily in His service and always to His glory and the benefit of His Church.

Faithfully Yours in Christ,

+Bill

Bishop of Albany

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Poster	Thread
Joe of the Mountain	Posted: 2007/3/29 17:25 Updated: 2007/3/29 17:33
Home away from home Joined: 2004/1/3 From: Posts: 3472	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME This is a good example of the folly of the Frankfurt School's teaching that heritage is irrelevant and "nurture" is everything. Herzog sounds to me vaguely Slavic to my ears, perhaps Balkan, but at any rate it is clearly not an English/Celtic/Germanic/French sounding name and thus to my point: Quote: ... he and Carol have decided to return to their roots ... The pull of heritage is strong and often subconscious. "Converts" may have good reason at the time of conversion, but homeostasis is equally powerful and perhaps moreso. How many "Episcopalians" that "went home" to Rome were RCs themselves or members of traditionally Roman Catholic families? A great many I suspect. And so the question of nationality, with its associated national church, is raised once more. Can it be that Anglicanism speaks most compellingly to those descended from the various peoples of England? Evidently, Romanism speaks very compellingly to those whose ancestry hails from the former Roman Empire, even fifteen hundred years after its demise. If we look at the entrenched European religions of the USA, we see a cluster of English-origin, a cluster of Lutheran-origin (i.e., from the northern fringe of the former Roman Empire, the once-conquered lands of the Barbarians) and a cluster of Roman-origin. (To clarify, despite their superficial differences, "Baptist-ism", Methodism, Presbyterianism, Prayerbook Anglicanism and even their off-shoots have an astounding amount in common even to-day, the distinctions more tactical than strategic.) So it owuld seem, absent compelling external influences, the natural inclination is to revert to one's ancestral affiliations. In the language of power, this seems to indicate "referent" power is strong, albeit low-temperature, and persistent. The implications for these United States are chilling, if the present anarchy in the Church extends to the civil government or society.

chaps	Posted: 2007/3/29 17:55 Updated: 2007/3/29 17:55
Home away from home Joined: 2007/2/11 From: Posts: 451	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME JOTM wrote: “This is a good example of the folly of the Frankfurt School's teaching that heritage is irrelevant and 'nurture' is everything. “Herzog sounds to me vaguely Slavic to my ears, perhaps Balkan, but at any rate it is clearly not an English/Celtic/Germanic/French sounding name and thus to my point:” This is a good example of why it's important to do a slight bit of research instead of trusting your “ears” and engaging your biases. From the House of Names: “Spelling variations of this family name include: Herzog, Herzig, Hertzog, Hercog, Hartzog, Gertzog, Hartog, Hartoch, Hertogs, Hertogson and many more. “First found in Bavaria, where the name was anciently associated with the tribal conflicts of the area. “Some of the first settlers of this family name or some of its variants were: Baltzer Hartsoc, who arrived in Philadelphia in 1737; Andreas Herzog, who came to Philadelphia in 1750; Anna Herzog, who came to Carolina in 1738; as well as Franz Herzog, who was one of the Hessian Troops in the American War for Independence, recorded in 1778.” JOTM wrote: “The pull of heritage is strong and often subconscious....” Why not just admit that the retired Episcopal Bishop of Albany and his wife became Roman Catholics because they believe that is the most faithful choice available to them? No, parish the thought – God forbid – must be due to cultural factors. Blessings, chaps

esniii	Posted: 2007/3/29 18:38 Updated: 2007/3/29 18:38
Home away from home Joined: 2004/3/29 From: Posts: 398	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME JOTM wrote: “The pull of heritage is strong and often subconscious....” chaps replied: "Why not just admit that the retired Episcopal Bishop of Albany and his wife became Roman Catholics because they believe that is the most faithful choice available to them?" But even before we go there, were either +Herzog or his wife Roman Catholic before they became Episcopalian? (Back when the Episcopal Church was a Christian denomination, I mean...) If so then "return to home/roots" need not be taken as inaccurate or as following their cultural heritage, merely as returning to a Church to which they previously belonged, and whose leadership at least recognizes Christ was male and was also Son of God, whether or not you accept any other Roman Catholic dogma.

JBLower	Posted: 2007/3/29 19:56 Updated: 2007/3/29 19:56
Just can't stay away Joined: 2004/1/5 From: NC Posts: 98	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Joe, et al, According to Langenscheidt’s Deutsch-Englisches Wörterbuch, Herzog is the German word that translates to the title of Duke. It is most likely a southern German name, perhaps Bayerisch or Baden-Württembergisch, where Catholic is the predominant faith. Mit freundlichem Grüßen, Brad

Theophilos	Posted: 2007/3/29 20:00 Updated: 2007/3/29 20:01
Just can't stay away Joined: 2006/11/3 From: Posts: 91	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME This holy man first got his fat pension from the Episcopalian Cult, than went to Rome. This is what I call a wise man. The Diocese of Albany does not have a bishop yet, because the chief consecrater was the Holy Mother, so it was null.

Theophilos	Posted: 2007/3/29 20:04 Updated: 2007/3/29 20:04
Just can't stay away Joined: 2006/11/3 From: Posts: 91	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Joe Herzog is the German word for DUKE. It is a very common Jewish(ashkenazi) surname.

FrKing	Posted: 2007/3/29 20:41 Updated: 2007/3/29 20:41
Just popping in Joined: 2004/3/13 From: Posts: 5	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME No, Bishop Love's Chief Consecrator was ++Frank Griswold. There were no female co-consecrators either. Yes, both Dan and Carol Herzog were Roman Catholic until well into their adult years.

Helena	Posted: 2007/3/29 20:43 Updated: 2007/3/29 20:43
Just can't stay away Joined: 2006/7/16 From: Posts: 75	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Theo, A little research will prove that Bp. Love was consecrated by the Griz.

texknight	Posted: 2007/3/29 22:56 Updated: 2007/3/29 22:56
Just popping in Joined: 2007/3/29 From: Posts: 1	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME The identity of the consecrater does not effect the validity of the sacrament. See article 26 of the Articles of Religion: XXVI. Of the Unworthiness of the Ministers, which hinders not the effect of the Sacraments.

Frcorny	Posted: 2007/3/30 0:12 Updated: 2007/3/30 0:12
Quite a regular Joined: 2005/2/20 From: Holy Cross, Warrensburgh, NY Posts: 68	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Unless it is a woman for whom it is ontologically impossible to be a priest, bishop and therefore consecrator. Hence, orders are null and void. Anglican Paplist+

Cennydd	Posted: 2007/3/30 3:40 Updated: 2007/3/30 3:40
Home away from home Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 7348	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome No one should fault the Herzogs for doing what for them was the right thing to do. I certainly don't. Godspeed to both of them! Cennydd

ejsteele	Posted: 2007/3/30 12:47 Updated: 2007/3/30 12:47
Home away from home Joined: 2004/10/18 From: Posts: 360	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome Thank you, Cennydd, for your thoughts. I agree that such a choice should be lifted up in prayer, and not analyzed by anyone. As one who has made the same choice, and earlier this week surrendered my license with the Traditional Church of England, I know how much prayer goes into such a decision. And for anyone who wishes to analyzes my situation: I was raised in the Methodist Episcopal Church and ALL of my ancestors came from England. I simply believe that the Roman Catholic Church is the best place for my family and I to be, though it may not be for everyone. Ed

Joe of the Mountain	Posted: 2007/3/30 15:09 Updated: 2007/3/30 15:28
Home away from home Joined: 2004/1/3 From: Posts: 3472	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Aha! Thanks Theophilus. I went to high school with a Herzog family and they were Polish Jews.

Joe of the Mountain	Posted: 2007/3/30 15:13 Updated: 2007/3/30 15:14
Home away from home Joined: 2004/1/3 From: Posts: 3472	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME If you had bothered to read what I wrote you would see I don't give a fig for the validity of the CoR. My point is that ethnic solidarity trumps "reason" and that people from the historic Roman Empire -- to which Bavaria certainly qualifies! -- return to their Imperial roots when external factors have been removed. (This is likely the true reason the EU is being shoved down their throats, for that matter... Once an imperialist, always an imperialst -- it's in their blood!) Homeostasis is the controlling authority -- not some phony poo-bah with funny clothing. Geese. No wonder the early Americans wrote Protestantism into their constitutions, having to deal with this kind of ecclesiastical sniping every day...

Joe of the Mountain	Posted: 2007/3/30 15:22 Updated: 2007/3/30 15:22
Home away from home Joined: 2004/1/3 From: Posts: 3472	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome So are you suggesting, as has the touchy-feely Left for the last generation, that analysis is morally wrong? Why on earth would you suggest such a thing? Human behavior is almost completely predictable at the group level and our trillion-dollar economy is proof of that scientific fact. Even at the individual level, behavior is predictable within certain tolerance ranges. To pretend that human decisions are exempt from external analysis is an abrogation of one's duty to himself, his nation and his God for God himself commands us to be "wise as serpents". Methinks the real reason is that some people simply do not want to have their motives examined for whatever reason. In that case, may I suggest that so-called "private" decisions then REMAIN PRIVATE?

Joe of the Mountain	Posted: 2007/3/30 15:27 Updated: 2007/3/30 15:27
Home away from home Joined: 2004/1/3 From: Posts: 3472	Re: ALBANY: BISHOP HERZOG AND WIFE RETURN TO ROME Danke, mein bruder.

uncleowen	Posted: 2007/3/30 20:22 Updated: 2007/3/30 20:22
Just popping in Joined: 2007/3/30 From: Posts: 1	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome According to the wisdom of Joe, one would assume every Slavic Jew given half a chance will always slid back into usuary and money-lending. That's just how they are... Welcome to our world, Shylock! I find this analysis of the Former Bishop Dan Herzog's conversion insulting. As a priest in his diocese, I am certain the decision was made after heartfelt prayer and guidance from the Holy Spirit. The same attitude, Joe, or belief (what have you)-- isn't it being used against our African friends? "You know those superstitious, animist Africans..." To talk about Daniel Herzog's pull toward Catholicism being a pull one finds in those Slavs is, IMHO, quite jingoistic. I think we can de better than that. Uncleowen

Isaac	Posted: 2007/3/30 21:53 Updated: 2007/3/30 21:53
Home away from home Joined: 2004/3/1 From: Texas Posts: 672	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome JINGOISTIC- fanatically patriotic. I had to look it up. Isaac

Frcorny	Posted: 2007/3/31 1:26 Updated: 2007/3/31 1:26
Quite a regular Joined: 2005/2/20 From: Holy Cross, Warrensburgh, NY Posts: 68	Re: ALBANY: Bishop Herzog & Wife Return to Rome That particular three year decision and discernment process bothers the heck out of me. Again, as I have said on other blogs and threads I strongly object to the force feeding of female clergy under the guise of the "I experienced their ministry and it was good" rational in direct opposition to the theology of the vast majority of Christendom (Like a billion and a half believers). Mr. Herzog said to me, when he was a priest, that he did not think it was ontologically possible for a woman to be a priest. When he was ordained bishop evidently he was struck by lightening and the glory and rightness of ordaining females sprung full blown from his forehead. When I returned to Albany from Fort Worth (where I went right after his elevation to the bishopric) he had placed feminists in many pulpits and had ordained a flock of them. During his three year discernment process he continued to force feed them into the system and did so right up to the eve of his retirement. Then another bolt of lightening evidently hit him and he again sees the light; that no, it is impossible for a female to be a priest and "poof" he joins Rome where he will not have to suffer as a parishioner of one of his own creations. Sorry, I don't buy it. There are other areas in which my Anglo-catholic hackles were raised by Daniel; his love of the 1979 prayer book and refusal to allow any of the traditional liturgies to be used in the churches in the Diocese, his being enamored of charismatic pseudo-liturgy, the attempt to make charismatic healing the center of the Diocese massive Spiritual Life Center. I don't doubt he helped many to a "personal relationship to Jesus". That can happen, I believe, much more effectively, however, by traditional teaching and Sacramental worship. Any way, I wish him well, although I think Rome should make him do penance by making him attend a parish with one of the more emotionally challenged females he arranged to take a pulpit. My prayers will go to the diocese. It is not as solid as some suspect. I hope the defections of its former bishops do not adversely affect giving. Between this happening and the House of Bishops showing their backsides to the Anglican Communion we may all be looking for a place to hide. Or march to Thermopilye.