Merely the very beginning, folks!

Only the Lord knows, and we do not, how this SHI* will play out. Personally, I am too numb for outrage, but gratefully look to the SANE among our leaders to act swiftly to excise this cancer from among us!

For blight it is, and I have no boubt that the Global South will beat the proverbial crap out of Canterbury over this succession of outrages!

Surely the need for the early reformation had NOTHING on the Apostate ECUSA! Any takers on this comment?

Blessings . . .

Yikes!!! The Episcopal Political Party moves even further left.

Quote:

The ECUSA has been declaired a pagan cult. Mother worship of the Wiccans. Blessed Be

I tell you now, it will get more bizarre with each passing day.

While battling the feminazis at Penn State ca 1992, I attended a "Women's Studies" class.

The course syllabus included, "The Herstory of Feminism". This was explained as removing the influence of the patriarchy from a class on oppressed genders.

Uh huh.

What this brilliant PhD in Womyn's Studies didn't know was that history is a Latinate word related to story and "his/her/their" are Germanic pronouns courtesy of the Scandinavians.

But what's an etymology amongst friends?

JS uttered: "Our mother Jesus gives birth to a new creation. And you and I are His children."

Mother Jesus???? Can someone please tell me what book JS is reading from? It can't be the Bible, since she says that homosexulaity is not a sin, where the Bible says it is an abomination to God (translation: it's a sin).

Is it time that someone reviewed with her the basics of gender biology? She seems to have forgotten.

Well Joe,

What doesn't kill us makes us stronger, eh?
I am glad you are with us, scars and all!

As a former classmate of the PB-elect at CDSP, I have now been proven correct of the false teachings of that establishment, where everything is about making the individual look better (ignoring sin in the process)but methods that confuse the Truth when it is openly visible to all. It is the reason they no longer send me mailings asking for money. Worse still is my degree certificate signed by the newly authorized Bishop of Nth California as Chair of the Board of CDSP!!!

On an interesting side note, I found it fascinating to read that the PB-elects daughter (whom I remember as a sweet young lady with braces) is now commissioned and flying planes for the USAF. Similarly Bp. Spong's (of not sainted memory) daughter is a Captain in the USMC who flies helicopters. Having liberal parents, seems to me to be a good grounding to looking at the world from a totally different light, but it still impresses me that the daughters of these two, and I am sorry Kathy, heretics seem to view social obligation very different to their parents.


Orate Fratres

Alasdair+

JS has forgotten NOTHING. The trouble for us, is that we don't know WHAT she believes, and WHAT will come from her perverted center!

I can't keep up anymore...

First, Jesus and Mary Magdalene have a love child before she flees to the south of France...

Then, VGR tells us Jesus "MAY" have been gay...

Now, mother Jesus is giving birth.

I think KJS flew a little too close to the sun the last time she flew a plane. Next time, use oxygen.

Hopefully, she will stay out of theology and occupy herself with moving the headquarters out of NYC. I think she should move the headquarters to Salt Lake City. Someone lean over and tell her it's pretty at Christmas there.

Well...let's not get so carried away by our zeal for The True Tradition that we make that Tradition narrower and more rigid than it actually is.

In fact, there is nothing radical or heretical in Mrs. Jefferts Schori's language, after all. Such unimpeachably orthodox saints as Bernard of Clairvaux and Julian of Norwich spoke of Jesus as "our Mother", who brings us to birth as a New Creation and feeds us from His own Body. Many Syriac-speaking saints, like Ephrem and Aphrahat, followed the grammer of their own language (and Hebrew) by using feminine pronouns and images for the Holy Spirit, and St. Jerome (the crustiest of Church Fathers) said that this was completely biblical.

When, in our opposition to excessive feminism, we go too far the other way and seek to "cleanse" the Tradition of the "feminism" that's legitimately there, all we do is drive many women (and some men) away from the Tradition and into the arms of the real radicals. This is not a prudent or godly thing to do.

So...you can legitimately object to many things that Mrs. Jefferts Schori does and says. This prayer to 'Jesus our Mother', however, isn't one of them. It's perfectly cool, to those who really know the Tradition.

Pax,

John

I am he and you are me and we are all together

I am the egg man, they are the eggmen, I am the walrus
Koo-koo koo-joob

Glory be to egg man, and the egg men, and the walrus.
As it is right now, and will be, for a little while anyway. Amen . .maybe . . in a present kind of way . . I like mine to swing both ways . .right now . . sort of . . all at the same time and nowhere!

Break on through to other side! Yeah! Yeah! Yeah! Yeeeeaaahhhhh!

So...you can legitimately object to many things that Mrs. Jefferts Schori does and says. This prayer to 'Jesus our Mother', however, isn't one of them. It's perfectly cool, to those who really know the Tradition.

To insinuate that some obscure references within the history of Christianity actually constitutes the Tradition is laughable . . . . at best.

Please produce the widely used liturgical texts and prayers wherein Jesus is referred to as "our mother."

The Episcopal Church is now officially beyond parody. Nothing - absolutely nothing - is too bizarre to attribute to the wild-eyed pagans and heretics holding the levers.

Luke 11:34 The light of the body is the eye. Therefore when your eye is sound, your whole body also is full of light. But when your eye is evil, your body also is full of darkness.

It's time to remove 'Episcopal' from our church signs and stationery. She promotes bondage to the enslaved, and she blaphemes the Lord Jesus. Haven't we all had ENOUGH?

I CAN'T believe this statement .. and coming from a "rev. canon" no less !!! ...

[The Rev. Canon Eugene McDowell of the Diocese of North Carolina explained, "This type of language was used in 1920s and 1930s to alienate the type of people who were executed. It was called the Holocaust."]

Think about it. This "clergyman" is saying that Christology was part of the basis of Nazi ideology and led to the holocaust! The Nazi's hated everything Christian - even banning their beloved Wagner's opera 'Parsifal.' Putrid, delussional, self-righteous, liberal social justice on full display.

For the Love of God - friends - get out that abomination of an organization.

John, my friend,

Please. Without the opportunity to review your references, I believe that you are taking them out of context. When the Christian Church was either Roman Catholic or Eastern, the only female reference to the Body of Christ was "the Holy Mother Church", which is still used today by our RC brethren. Jesus never gives us birth. God, the father (not mother), through the Holy Spirit does. Yes, I know that God transends gender, but the Bible is paternal. We have no authority to add or subtract to it, although TEC appears to think it can.

yours,

.....and to think only a week ago, my prayers for this convention only covered ECUSA's response to the Windsor Report!!

What do I pray when they also refuse to consider a resolution on their belief in the saving grace of Jesus Christ and post remarks on the 'gender'correctness of Christ?

If this were not SO sad, I would feel like laughing........This has been a Clockwork Orange kind of week. It has been bizarre, confusing, frightening and I have felt I have been in a very unholy place.

The Jesus Christ I know and worship is the SON of God and was born to a Virgin Mary and HE was sent to this world to save the world.........Little did I know we would need HIS saving grace more than ever in 2006 and within the church I have loved for forty years.

This church came into this convention known as ECUSA and it leaves as the Church of Sardis......read your warnings carefully, Sardis, He has given you fair warning!! (Rev.3:1-6)

Bishop-elect Katherine Jefferts Schori just firms up my belief that women don't belong in the clergy.

"So...you can legitimately object to many things that Mrs. Jefferts Schori does and says. This prayer to 'Jesus our Mother', however, isn't one of them. It's perfectly cool, to those who really know the Tradition."

Ahhh, but if you're reading the material coming out of ECUSA, you know that we're being taught that "context" is everything and "Tradition" means little or nothing.

If you're OK with Jesus' Motherhood and with Tradition, do you surpose the "motherhood" resulted from an Imaculate Conception?

Joe said "I tell you now, it will get more bizarre with each passing day."

You are being too kind Joe. Too kind.

Mad^Infinity, people.

BHTech

I was kind of unsure before but now it's all crystal clear as to where TEC is headed!! You just wait until the next meeting, they're gonna get it!

Mrs. Jefferts Schori has shown herself to be a heretic and an enemy of Christ.

The leaders of the ACN must recognize what a precarious position they are now in - they are standing on the verge of discrediting themselves by inaction.

Those of you lay claim to the title "orthodox" - it was time to leave 3 years ago.

ok, stop me if you've heard this:

Q: Why can't Episcopaliens play chess?

A: They can't tell the queens from the bishops...

For a long time The Episcopal Cult has been a parody of a Christian church. Now it has become a parody of that parody.

I have long felt the Episcopal Church was going to hell in a handbasket. This week proves one thing--it has arrived.

We at The Church of the Holy Implication here in Truth or Consequences, New Mexico, are not surprised.

The logic that promotes same sex inclusion is based on the premise that God made it, and therefore it is Godly to act on it. And the people promoting the new theology identify themselves as LGBT affirming.

Thus, our rector and vestry determined that the same logic affirms the activites of Bisexual and Transgender also.

We at the Church of the Holy Implication are not surprised. Its only logical.

The old saying of "the inmates have taken over the asylum" applies so sharply to GC2006. First, it rules that the new testament is anti-semitic. Then they rule that the bible is oppressive. And adding the final insult it rules that Jesus is a liar- he is not the only way to the Father. The gay thing pales in comparison. They have thumbed their nose at the worldwide Anglican community and stuck a stick its eye to boot!

Is this some Bizarro World!!

For those still in this abomination of a church, why?? Your church has been hijacked and you cannot get it back. Your only hope is for the rest of the communion to declare them dead to the communion and recoginizes a seperate entity that you can claim.

Cathromang,

I heard that one awhile back and still find it very funny

All,

Of course there are infrequent linguistic feminine references to God here and there in Christian history (oops?)... Julian of Norwich, yes, and even Jesus' own words to Jerusalem (hen/mother bird, etc... Mt 23.37) All these together make an interesting adult education class... BUT for PB elect to use "Mother Jesus" language in her first public utterances reflects far more than a casual remark. Stand by for the same old same old--just more of it.

At least the fascade of dialog has been ripped away. [note the late-breaking "minority statement of conscience--not from the Right but the Left bishops!]

We all have choices to make... with holy fear, Prodigal

Yes, the handbasket has arrived and the doors to the pit of Hell have been opened. The Blasphemeress-in-Chief of the episcobaal church has already jumped into that basket and now is urging her voluntary and involuntary minions to also hop in.

"ok, stop me if you've heard this:"

STOP! ;)

Fine, she likes inclusive language. Then she won't mind if I call her

Father Katherine Schori

I have been in the Episcopal Church since 1950. I have attended an Episcopal Elementary School run by the Sisters of the Transfiguration. I got the God and Country Award for the Episcopal Church while a member of the Boy Scouts of America. For what its worth, I was confirmed by James Pike. Some might say that I need to be reconfirmed--no need to do that now. It saddens be to see a great institution be trampled and destroyed by well-intentioned heretics. As for me and my house we will serve the Lord. I will proclaim Jesus(a guy) as my Lord and Saviour. And I will remain in your face calling sin for what it is--death. Homosexuality is bad for your health and death for your soul.

And a smartly-woven handbasket it is, with pink ribbons and triangles, and rainbow-coloured doo-dads! Doesn't it look gay and attractive!?

Here we go!...this is going to be such fun to watch! Presiding Mother Schori is heading straight down the Wiccan path, with the rest of the Episcopagans...I wonder what Boy Rowan thinks about this?

To those still in ECUSA: GET OUT, YOU FOOLS!!!, before she has everyone sitting nekkid in a circle around a bonfire on the altar...

MCB

This is pure madness,as some one said just God knows how this GC06 will end.Guys this kind of stuff will be headline worldwide,the life of ours brothers anglicans in Africa will get very
defficult,in countries like Nigeria,Kenya,Uganda,
Ruanda,Sudan there is very few animists today,the people are almost muslim or Christians
The others Churches and the muslims,they will try to covert anglicans,saying that they are members of
a pervert organization that promotes sodomy.
and for our brothers in Pakistan, Middle East,
Malaysia and other muslim countries the live will be worst.I don't know if I cry or laugh.She
is the antichrist,the reencarnation of Judas.

"On an interesting side note, I found it fascinating to read that the PB-elects daughter (whom I remember as a sweet young lady with braces) is now commissioned and flying planes for the USAF. Similarly Bp. Spong's (of not sainted memory) daughter is a Captain in the USMC who flies helicopters. "

God bless both of these brave young women. It's good to have someone in the family who believes in defending something decent.

Truly, truly it is a sad day when this woman transgenderizes Our Lord and Savior. In our faith's 2000 year history never has a anyone to my knowledge tried this, that would not have been declared a Heretic. Yet, here is the new P.B. doing just that, and appaerntly the House of Bishops seems to now believe that declaring our Lord and Saviour as He or Our Lord or anything else deffinitive or male would be wrong and anti inclusion! Perhaps they should have renamed themselves the Unitarian Episcopal Universalist Fellowship Church? That might be a more fitting name.
In closing She is in fact a Heretic of the first order and perhaps the House of Bishops are Heretics as well.

I have often wondered if we are heading down Nietzsche's path here, since America is about a century slower than Europe in the God-is-dead department...

You are right about the "mad" BH. These freaks have made a psychotic break with reality. It is only the incredible wealth of our respective economies that allows them to survive, seperated from that reality.

Think about it -- if ECUSick were financed out of cash flow, not asset earnings, Who would give money to these charlatans???

No one would. And they would either reconnect with reality or starve to death. But since ECUSick has more cash than it can spend, they do not need to obey any known physical laws. In the short term.

They are quite mad. and rich. but still mad.

Greetings to all,
I've always been a sorta bottom line guy. And, I think the bottom line here is this. These people were allowed into Christian ministry without first being Christians. They do not know the Resurrected Power of Jesus Christ in their lives. And this includes the PB-elect, the PB, and many if not most of the clergy at the general convention. As for the non-Christian delegates, they don't stand an iceberg's chance in hell of meeting the Christ in such an environment from these types of clergy. I mean, greater is He who dwells within us than he who dwells in the world.

Most of the ECUSA clergy dwell, in a personally empty state vis-a-vis our Lord, in the world with the enemy. The problem becomes that their souls are devoid of the Holy Spirit, and voids, in this world, seldom stay void for very long.

What has crept into their "soulspace" and into the church is not of God: +Father, +Son, and +Holy Spirit.

Lord have mercy,

Dan

Dollars to donuts their Wicca "theology" will be as wacky as their Christian theology, more from that silly television program with the teenaged chicks running around in skimpy outfits (whatever it is called) than any serious Wicca priestess...

In other words, they have only cartoon characatures of whatever they do.

Frjude, several months ago, +John-David Schofield gave permission for parishes in this diocese to replace the name "Episcopal" with the name "Anglican" on their signs, and I believe one or two have done it. I think more will follow after the Standing Committee meets.

Cennydd

II Judas iii.5:

5. Yea verily, she which hath the goodes maketh the rules and none shalt refuse her list, nay not a single one for the women and children shall lead.

I always loved that cartoon:
Picture the man with a surprised look on his face reading graffiti on an ally wall: "God is dead. signed N."

And under it in a beautiful hand written response "N. is dead. Signed God."

D

The experience of GC'06 has been like watching a slow motion version of a train slamming into a loaded school bus.

Unfortunately, this is not just a bad a dream from which we can wake ourselves.

The birth of a new cult! Jesus as Mother cultism. Is there any reason to stay?

http://rhymeswithright.mu.nu/archives/182782.php

So let me see if I have this straight (forgive the exclusive language) -- the ECUSA will not affirm a fundamental point of the historic Christian faith contained in Scripture, but it will fiddle around with Jesus' genitals. How can a Christian actually stay a member?

This is why it's long past time to resurrect all the old cliches and aphorisms:

"Speak of the Devil and he's bound to appear."

These fools have invoked more than they can handle. May God have mercy on their souls.

He can't.

Unless of course he is a missionary to the heathen savages.

"Frjude, several months ago, +John-David Schofield gave permission for parishes in this diocese to replace the name "Episcopal" with the name "Anglican" on their signs..."

You and I are in the same diocese, and FORTUNATE to have a godly man like +John-David as our Bishop. My parish will be considering such a move in the near future.

For a long time The Episcopal Cult has been a parody of a Christian church. Now it has become a parody of that parody. (hat tip: alonzo)


A recent story about a modern art exhibition (in the WSJ this week) told how a fine sculpted head was separated by accident from its base. The hastily made, bare plinth won recognition, while the head was rejected. The point was: sometimes the culture (=ecusa) gets so outrageous that parody becomes impossible.

laughing and crying at the same time,
gideon

Perhaps the episcobaal church is trying to avoid being vomited out of Jesus' mouth by being completely cold instead of lukewarm...

Two questions for anyone so versed ...

1 - Did Julian of Norwich, in this "Jesus/Mother" language she used, really talk about Jesus "giving birth" to the world? As opposed to "creating"?

2 - In my mind, "giving birth" and "creating" are two very different things. As "The Word" Jesus was God's agent in creation. "Giving birth" implies "begat" -- as in Jesus being begotten of the Father. Creation is the work of God - not His physical offspring.

Is this too fine a point - am I off base on this? Seems to me this is a very dangerous alteration - almost mormon-like in implying the creation is in essence a divine offspring.

s

The Spirit says unto the believers, "This body has rejected the Head. The cornerstone is cast away from the foundation. My Son is no longer their Lord. They have placed themselves in service to the Satan. In Their wisdom, They know more than the entire host, the whole company of the Angels of light. Quickly, go and take yourselves apart from the abomination that is the church in New York. I have watched her in her transgressions. I have wept for her debasement. She has cast aside the prophets I have sent unto her. The stench of her defilement is wretched unto my nostrils. My anger is white-hot. I have done with her. Know this you faithful, come out from her, for my judgment pours even now upon her head, from veil to sandal I am pouring out upon her my condemnation. I have hardened her heart, she will resist me even unto the last of days, yes, even unto the judgment of life and death will she spew her poison.

Yet it is not my judgment that she be utterly destroyed and seen no more. She will stagger on painfully under the weight of her own abominations, scorned by the true Church, a byword and nothing more. Yet I intend her to be a lingering reproach unto you, that you may not forget what role you have played in her debasement. Many times have I raised up prophets in your midst. Many times have I called for the faithful in her midst to rise up and resist the barbarous innovations, the baseless teachings and outright abominations. But you were afraid. You did not abide in faith. You did not trust in my grace and power to work through you. You were quiet when I asked you to shout. You sat when I called you to stand. You walked when I told you to fight.

It is now far past the hour, it is too late. Have nothing more to do with her. I have set a wall between you and her. You will not wrest control of the beast, her judgment is to continue on her journey, spiraling down to the lake of fire. You are powerless before my judgment. Cast off your fear of departure, now is the time to walk. Cast off your anger, now is the time to repent. Cast off your desire for vengeance, now is the time to pray. These former things will avail you nothing. The latter shall be your course. Repent of your role in her journey and recommit yourselves to the Commission. The harvest is still so great, while the laborers are yet so few. Waste not your time in kicking against the goads. Yes, set yourselves apart from her or risk a share in her torment. Undertake the tasks to which you committed yourselves in Baptism." So saith the Spirit. Amen.

Dan, there is very little consolation to be found in any of this insanity, but the 'little' consolation is that ECUSA did not consult the Presbyterians............they ( the Presbyt.) spent entirely too much time in creative thought when they came up with "Mother, Child and Womb"

Quite right Kiev Caves. This is what happens when scripture gets swamped in other voices. There is a lot of good material in the fathers of the church, but lets not forget where our roots lie. I think that is what most of the fathers would say, if they were here now!

The only feminine reference to Jesus that I can think of in scripture is where he uses the analogy of a hen gathering its chicks. The references from various medieval authors cited by JMichal seem to go a lot further than that, and without warrant.

The Hebrew word for "spirit" is feminine in gender, but that again doesn't mean a lot in a language with only two genders (male and female, no neutral with a couple of isolated exceptions).

I note also that JMichal cited Jerome as saying the feminine side of God is supported by scripture - wouldn't it be better to look at what scripture says, rather than what Jerome says that scripture says? I am not picking a fight with Jerome - he was a great teacher - but I think he himself would say: "If you want to know if something is supported by scripture, don't just take my word for it, check it for yourself". That is after all why he translated the bible into a language which at the time was the common vernacular of western europe - so ordinary people could read it.

I don't doubt that all the fulness of both masculinity and femininity is found in our Lord - after all, he created both. But on the issue of headship, it seems to me that the Scriptures always refer to God as male. I hope the High Priestess doesn't do something nasty to me for saying that....

This reaction is the sort of thing that frustrates me as a (relatively) conservative Christian who has been considering joining an Anglican church. The Anglican church has been, historically, the Via Media, and, regardless of which groups appropriate that term for themselves today, that has always been the beautiful thing about it - its ability to be, as it were, a Protesting Catholic church. What worries me is that the most vocal opponents of the incipient liberalism in ECUSA tend to be voicing their dissent in a voice that is almost entirely in tune with the broader culture of American evangelicalism. This leads to things like playing fast and loose with canon law (see, for example, non-geographic jurisdictions), and a serious disregard for tradition.

The fact is, there is major precedent for reference to God (and Christ, and even the Apostle Paul!) as mother, especially in the medieval tradition. See, for example, Julian of Norwich, St. Bernard of Clairvaux, and even St. Anselm of Canterbury (see particularly his Prayers and Mediations, if you want to read what exactly he says). Now, the context for the references to Christ as mother in the medievals was completely different, most importantly, rising out of a rather dualistic view of body and soul, which was, of course, accompanied by a view of gender that was substantially different than ours. That to say, there is nothing unorthodox about +Schori's words - they could, in theory, be backed by an orthodox theology (I'd hardly call St. Anselm a heretic); however, there is most certainly something unorthodox about the theology with which she herself would back them up, and that is the point that needs to be addressed - that she is play-acting at orthodoxy. Yelling "Heretic!" without an understanding of the issues or an attempt to unpack and engage the real heresy just serves to lessen the credibility of the conservative wing in the eyes of other conservative and moderate Christians, especially those with a commitment to the entirety of the tradition of the church.

Pushnpaper,

I have never seen a *gay* handbasket - nor do I care ever to see a *gay* handbasket.



I had to let that one out

Aw shucks - some wag will design and construct one now

A Parsons

At no point in your post do you enquire what our Lord or his Apostles said about this issue in the Scriptures. If you want to oppose Ms Schori on the basis of medieval tradition, go ahead. I will certainly concur with you in the result. But that is not the basis on which I oppose her.

TO THE FAITHFUL IN CHRIST JESUS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD:

We, the undersigned, Bishops of the Episcopal Church make the following statement:

In the wake of the action by this House granting consent to the consecration of Canon V. Gene Robinson as Bishop of New Hampshire in 2003, many of us in this House made an appeal to the Archbishop of Canterbury and the Primates of the Anglican Communion “to intervene in the pastoral emergency that has overtaken us.” That appeal was heard and the Archbishop called for an extraordinary meeting of the Primates on 15-16 October, 2003. The Primates spoke forthrightly and unanimously about the consequences that would ensue across the Communion in the event that the consecration went forward, warning that it would “tear the fabric of our Communion at its deepest level.” They also called for the formation, under a mandate given by the Archbishop, of the Lambeth Commission on Communion. This General Convention has now given its response to the recommendations of the work of that Commission, known as the Windsor Report.

Now, once again, we find the need to speak candidly. The responses which the Convention has given to the clear and simple requests of the Lambeth Commission, the clear and simple requests indeed of the Anglican Communion, are clearly and simply inadequate. We reaffirm our conviction that the Windsor Report provides the way forward for the entire Anglican Communion, the ecumenical relationships of the Communion, and the common life of a faithful Episcopal Church. Further, we have agreed to submit ourselves to the Windsor Report’s requirements, both in what it teaches and in the discipline it enjoins. We have not changed in our commitment.

Sadly, because of statements made by members of this House at this Convention, we must question whether this General Convention is misleading the rest of the Communion by giving a false perception that they intend actually to comply with the recommendations of the Windsor Report. We therefore disassociate ourselves from those acts of this Convention that do not fully comply with the Windsor Report.

It is our intention not only to point to the inadequacies of the General Convention’s responses, but to declare to our brothers and sisters in Christ throughout the Communion that we continue as The Episcopal Church in this country who uphold and propagate the historic faith and order we have come to know through the Anglican heritage of apostolic teaching and biblical faith; who desire to be fully a constituent member of the Anglican Communion; and who are ready to embrace and live under the Windsor Report without equivocation. Accordingly, we repudiate the actions of the General Convention of 2003 which have breached the bonds of affection within the Communion. We bishops have committed to withhold consents for any persons living in same gender relationships who may be put forward for consecration as a bishop of the Church. And we have refused to grant authority for the blessing of sexual relationships outside Christian Marriage in our jurisdictions. We intend to go forward in the Communion confidently and unreservedly.

Our chief concern now is to fulfill our charge as bishops of the Church of God in the Anglican tradition to “guard the faith, unity and discipline” of the Church. Pastoral care and apostolic teaching must not only be given to our own dioceses, but to all the faithful in this country who seek apostolic oversight and support. We will take counsel together to fulfill our service on behalf of faithful Anglicans in this country, both clergy and laity, and to proclaim the Gospel and build up the Church of our Lord Jesus Christ, and we seek the support of the Archbishop of Canterbury and the Primates and Bishops of the Anglican Communion as we do so.

Signed . . .

The Rt. Rev. Keith Lynn Ackerman, Diocese of Quincy
The Rt. Rev. James M. Adams Jr., Diocese of Western Kansas
The Rt. Rev. Peter H. Beckwith, Diocese of Springfield
The Rt. Rev. Robert Wm. Duncan, Diocese of Pittsburgh
The Rt. Rev. Daniel W. Herzog, Diocese of Albany
The Rt. Rev. Jack L. Iker, DD, Diocese of Fort Worth
The Rt. Rev. Edward L. Salmon, Jr., Diocese of South Carolina*
The Rt. Rev. John-David Schofield, Diocese of San Joaquin
The Rt. Rev. James M. Stanton, Diocese of Dallas*
The Rt. Rev. Henry W. Scriven, Diocese of Pittsburgh
The Rt. Rev. William J. Skilton, Diocese of South Carolina
The Rt. Rev. William J. Cox, Retired
The Rt. Rev. Alex D. Dickson, Retired

* Drafters of the original statement

I am holding fast to the hope that Bishop Duncan
will lead our parish away from TEC. I know he is trying to avoid total schism, and I'm praying for him and the other like-minded bishops.

There is very little basis for an opposition to Schori based on the New Testament; an argument from silence is, in this case, not the most solid of arguments. All that can be solidly argued from the New Testament is that we ought not to refer to the Father or the Son exclusively or primarily as female, not that we ought never to do so. Given the relative lack of clarity of Scripture (and, remember, Scripture is more than just our Lord and his Apostles), we ought then to turn to the Catholic and Orthodox tradition of exegesis and theology for guidance in navigating a difficult issue. Even then, I admit, the fact that a Catholic and Orthodox writer says something does not necessarily make it true; however, that's not what I'm claiming - I'm claiming that it ought to give us pause before we declare a similar statement to be bald and open heresy.

DING..DING We've arrived in downtown Kooksville. End o' the line... Everybody off!

The believer is born of God. Female language-- born.
Katherine Schori was a good egg Not quite hatched, her egg fell out of the nest-- definitely a cracked egg.

well, I was certainly wrong about KJS' electability when I wrote on 2/2:

DV also wrote: But the choice of bishop who must truly rank as the most in-your-face to the orthodox Global South Primates is Ms. Katharine Jefferts Schori, Bishop of Nevada ... Bishop Schori was fast-tracked into the Episcopacy, for reasons that still remain unclear.
____________________________________

Unclear is an understatement. This woman is no more qualified to be a bishop in God's church than my parish priest; actually, less so. Nomination for PB, much less election, is absolutely incredible. What an underwhelming choice. Is she included to mollify liberals who think the church isn't abandoning 2000 years of tradition fast enough? Or is she supposed to convince us that the other three are moderate? Either way, her inclusion on the slate tells us that something is very, very wrong with the discernment of the nominating committee.
__________________

I confess to failure to 'listen' and learn and inwardly digest the scope and scale of heresy in my church. I repent and beg forgiveness for grieving the Holy Spirit in this respect.
Faithfully,
Gideon

Ha-ha! Personally, I'd like to see the old-fashioned definition of "gay" come back. Kids these days probably think that the gay '90s (as in 1890s) meant that the homoeroticists were in charge during that decade. We know that lesbians and "gays" are anything but gay. Many of them are sad and troubled individuals who need deliverance and forgiveness.

Alasdair:

Check your VOL Inbox - not sure this is secure. Good to hear from you.

John Riebe+

When did Jesus have a sex-change operation?

And, when did Julius Streicher do any writing for the Episcopalians?

This McDowell fellow out of North Carolina must never have taken at least 20th century history 101. Even high school kids wouldn't have been so dumb as to come up with such drivel and ignorant nonsense.

What is the collective IQ of the people now running the ECUSA? Very low room temperature?

How very hard it is to read of such blasphemies against Our Lord Jesus Christ and the Church.
Just when one thinks the bottom of the gutter had been, at last, reached there is a new outrage.

Yet despite it all how very clarifying is it, to see in such stark terms the reality of Christianity versus this garish burlesque which we have witnessed in Ohio.

Surely we must take comfort in knowing that God is not mocked.
This current darkness only directs one towards He who illuminates and who truly liberates.

Look -- ANYONE who remains in the ridiculous joke of a social experiment called "the episcopal church" is NOT a Christian. This also applies to ANY "orthodox bishop" (pension people) who want to change parish signs (from ecusa to Anglican). One cannot be an Anglican Christian AND still be associated with ecusa!

Has anyone here ever heard of the Continuing Anglican Churches?? THEY need you now! For the sake of the Lord and your faith -- seek them out!!
Why are you so afraid of the true Anglican Churches, and still cling to a neo - pagan, gay/feminist cult?
Your fear completely alludes me.
Please pray to God -- He will find you a real home.

Alasdair,
May I ask how many years ago were you given the assignment to develop a same-sex rite?

I am curious to say the least.
Carol

drcribbage:

There has actually been some moves towards unity covering elements of both the Continuing Anglican movement and orthodox elements of ECUSA. The Concordat dated November 2005 between the Anglican Church of Nigeria, the Reformed Episcopalian Church, the Anglican Province of America and the United Episcopal Church of America contemplates formal merger between REC and APA by 2008. It also brings these churches into a closer communion with a number of ECUSA churches that have disaffiliated themselves from ECUSA.

In the end it will take leaders of the stature of Akinola and Grundorf to bring about Anglican revival.

BTW: It is interesting that the recent request for alternative episcopal oversight by the diocese of Fort Worth was NOT just directed to the Archbishop of Canterbury, as some have thought. The text from their web-site:

"The Bishop and the Standing Committee of the Episcopal Diocese of Fort Worth appeal in good faith to the Archbishop of Canterbury, the Primates of the Anglican Communion and the Panel of Reference for immediate alternative Primatial oversight and Pastoral Care following the election of Katharine Jefferts Schori as Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church.
This action is taken as a cooperative member of the Anglican Communion Network in light of the Windsor Report and its recommendations.
Vote: Unanimous in favor"

The inclusion of the Primates is interesting - any of them could respond. No dobut they will give Canterbury an opportunity to respond first!

Regards
Michael

Post removed by sender

I told y'all last week.
We would get Jeroboam. We would get Manasseh.
We would get someone whose little finger was bigger than his/her daddy's thigh.

Here we go into depravity.

PB-elect Schori is being a traditional Anglican in her language when she refers to Jesus as mother. This is the language used by Dame Julian of Norwich in her "Revelations of Divine Love" written in the 14th century.
See this link:
http://www.gloriana.nu/mother.htm
There is nothing new or unorthodox for Anglicans in +Schori's terminology.
God's peace,
Anna

Hosea
Posted: 2006/6/21 21:59

It is tough to ignore the word of 'Hosea', above.
Needs, prayerful attention, methinks.

Quote:

This is true only if she meant the same thing by the use of the term "mother" as these esteemed writers did. Since they believed the Apostolic Faith and she does not then one can only assume that her heterodox beliefs skew the interpretation.

Her use of ancient writers phrases may indeed be heterodox. The proof is in the interpretation. All words can be used either in an orthodox or heterodox sense. "The devil is in the details."

Neal

"All words can be used either in an orthodox or heterodox sense."

Good post! especially the above sentence which i try to come to grips with...


humbly, gregory

So, Katherine, you made Presiding Bishop! Well isn't that special!

So who helped you get that little title? Hmmm, let's see. Could it have been . . . oh, I don't know . . . SATAN ?

DnNeal,

Glory to Jesus Christ!!!

I think anyone who believes that Bishop Katherine is embracing the writings and beliefs of Bernard of Clairvaux and Julian of Norwich would be giving her too much credit.

After all, her divinity degree is only an honorary one. Her specialty is in Marine Biology.

Perhaps Bishop Katherine was comparing our Savior to a Sea Horse...Male Sea Horse's become pregnant as women do and give birth to their off spring. The Sea Horse can be both a male and a mother.

Hence her quote:
"Our mother Jesus gives birth to a new creation. And you and I are His children.".

That makes more scense to me. Sea Horses...not Saints...

ECUSA has swapped their 3-legged stools for rocking chairs

I don't think so, after all, a two dimensionally stable construct would be too restrictive to those whose justification relies on there being no references at all.

Andy

"The devil is in the details."

DnNeal,

This is so true, and hasn't he been busy with the details at this GC. Context, as we have painfully learned, is very inportant to those who espouse pluriform 'truths'. Perhaps we should consider a little more depth in what she has said in light of what she has done. If she so hated her own mother that she buried her using rites that her mother hated, and buried her in ground that her mother also hated, might not her reference of 'mother' be another expression of hatred toward the Lord, who has been rejected by her and this convention.

Actually, her ignorance of Christian doctrine could be attributed to her phony doctorate. Never haveing studied the subject she might not know what even our sunday school children should know, that we are children of God by adoption, not birth.

Andy

Today, in the liturgical calendar of the Roman Catholic Church, the holy martyrs St. John Fisher and St. Thomas More are commemorated. While they need no vindication or defense, it sure does warm the heart to see God's Name glorified in their lives and their deaths and in this logical suicidal conclusion of King Henry's rebellion.
Lord, have mercy on me a sinner.

Melkite6 said "Today, in the liturgical calendar of the Roman Catholic Church, the holy martyrs St. John Fisher and St. Thomas More are commemorated."

*********

Yeh Melkite6, today on EWTN they had a really good piece on Fisher and Moore. It seems many of the Bishops back in Henry VIII day when he declared himself to be head of the church caved in and submitted to him to save themselves. None of those Bishops are remembered today, but only Fisher and Moore for their service to their God and to their church.

God Bless

BHTech

Why is the idea of a female God blasphemy? Where in the Scripture does it state that God has testicles and is only to be referred to as 'he'?

Missl said "Why is the idea of a female God blasphemy? Where in the Scripture does it state that God has testicles and is only to be referred to as 'he'?"

***********

Do you believe that Jesus was both human and divine? God the Father, God the son and God the Holy Spirit expressed in the Trinity.

According to you would Jesus be male in the flesh and female in the divine? The Bible constantly refers to the "Father" in Jesus ministry. Have you seen Jesus use Mother when he talks about God?

The Lord's prayer: Our Father who art in heaven...

Go read your Bible please

The ECUSA might as well have elected Bishop V. Gene Robinson as Presiding Bishop, considering that Jesus, the SON of God, is considered by Bishop Schori to be a cross-dressing homosexual or a transgendered (read confused) homosexual by stating the Jesus is our mother! God help the ECUSA! It is doomed to damnation unless it returns to the teachings of Christ and the Apostles, not the teaching of deviants and degenerates! (See Romans, Chapter 1 and I Timothy Chapter 4)

Missl said "Why is the idea of a female God blasphemy? Where in the Scripture does it state that God has testicles and is only to be referred to as 'he'?"

*******************

Let me remind you

Psalm 23 (NIV)

1 The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not be in want.

2 He makes me lie down in green pastures,
he leads me beside quiet waters,

3 he restores my soul.
He guides me in paths of righteousness
for his name's sake.

Question for those smarter than me.

If Mother Jesus is the Husband and the Church is the bride, can they be married outside of Massachusetts?

Quote:

It's pagan. When used as the Prime Bishop Elect used it it is blasphemy. It also is trying to bring pagan elements into what should be Christian Worship. Heresy comes to mind as well. She has proved that the leaders of the church are heritics.

In light of what transpired in Ohio one should not be at all suprised to see the supporters of the overthrow of the true scurrying to find support for the new PB of ECUSA.

This Julian of Norwich was very much in the spirit of the New Age that we find ourselves in.
The God of JoN was incapable of judging, let alone any need to forgive any soul. No hell, no judgement, that sounds so New Age and it was yet another New/old gnostic sort of idea this Father-Mother God, as Mary Baker Eddy, American gnostic, called the Deity. JoN so did find uncomfortable the idea of God as Father that it necessitated this extraordinary idea of The Redeemer, He who said, I and the Father are one, and whose very BRIDE is the Church to be seen as "mother", well I know the feminists say "Sister Time" rather than Father Time so perhaps they know best after all. One might suggest, without any real concern for contradiction, that there is no place in the Gospels from which one might, in any way, come to the idea of Jesus the Christ as "mother".

The God of the Bible is very uncomfortable to many today as He has always been.

When I would read in the Book of Common Prayer about that which JoN DENIES as being aspects of God I suppose I am to take JoN over the Book of Common Prayer, or JoN over the very scriptures themselves.

Then again as almost a decade ago Vancouver’s bishop, Michael Ingham said that Jesus was NOT the only way, which the present gang in Ohio seems to have agreed with in voting down the affirmation of Jesus as He described Himself in the Gospels.

Frankly true Christians know better than to ally themselves with those who are, de facto, unbelievers.

1993. The Rev'd Prof Louis Weil had left Nashota for CDSP. I only did one year at CDSP... mercifully.

The TA for the class who drew up this assignment was the Rev, Juan Cabero Oliver, who became Exec officer of Newark.

One would think that Hans would learn to spell the Presiding Bishop-Elect's first name correctly. It is simply a case of sound journalism, much less manners.

It is Katharine. Note that "a" is used twice.
Such a sloppy error certainly leads to speculation over what other shortcuts were taken in properly preparing this, or any, of his articles.

Scott5342 ...

When I worked at Republic Steel years ago, we had a joke regarding this type of thing ...

For example, 300 tons of alloy steel having out of spec hydrogen (causing internal flaking) due to being poured into wet molds (because operations left the molds out in the rain). In the morning quality report, the engineer left out a period (.). Therefore operations rendered the report invalid -- "ship it out!"

And you, Jesus, are you not also a mother?
Are you not the mother who, like a hen,
gathers her chicks under her wings?
Truly, Lord, you are a mother;
for both they who are in labor
and they who are brought forth are accepted by you.
You have died more than they, that they may labor to bear life.
It is by your death that they have been born,
for if you had not died, you would not have brought forth life.
For, longing to bear your children into life,
you taste of death, and by dying you begot them...
So you , Lord God, are the great mother.
Even if you are father, you are also mother.
For you have brought it about that those born to death
should be reborn to life--
you by your own act.
Therefore you are father by your effect
and mother by your affection.
Father by your authority, mother by your kindness.
Father by your teaching, mother by your mercy.
Then you, Lord, are a mother...
And you, my soul, dead in yourself,
run under the wings of Jesus your mother
and lament your griefs under his feathers.
Ask that your wounds may be healed and that,
comforted, you may live again.
Christ, my mother, you gather your chickens under your wings;
this dead chicken of your scurries under those wings.
For by your gentleness the badly frightened are comforted...
your warmth gives life to the dead, your touch justifies sinners.
Mother, know again your dead one,
both by the sign of your cross and the voice of my confession.
Arm your chicken, give life to your dead one, justify your sinner.
Let your terrified one be consoled by you;
and in your whole and unceasing grace
let me be refashioned by you.
For from you flows consolation for sinners;
to you be blessing for ages and ages. Amen

St. Anselm, Archbishop of Canterbury, 1090

feetxxxl, did you see this;

by J. Budziszewski


"Are you Professor Theophilus?"
I turned. "That's me. Come in."
"My name's Lawrence. I'm gay. I came to complain about your talk about constitutional liberties yesterday. It was bigoted and homophobic. I'm filing a formal protest to the people who run the Student Union speakers series."
At least he’s direct, I thought. I waved him to a seat.
"Help me out, Mr. Lawrence. How could —"
"Just Lawrence."
"Thank you. Now how could my talk have been 'bigoted and homophobic' when it didn't mention homosexuality?"
"I didn't actually hear the talk itself. I came in during Q&A."
"I see. And what did I say during Q&A?"
"You said gays have sex with animals."
I'm used to this sort of thing, so I merely observed, "I'm afraid you weren't listening carefully."
"I remember distinctly," he declared. "A girl asked your opinion of laws against discrimination on on the basis of sexual orientation, and you said gays have sex with animals."
"No, What I said was 'sexual orientation' can mean many things. Some people are 'sexually oriented' toward the opposite sex; others toward the same sex; others toward children; others toward animals; others toward cadavers. I said that I wondered where this trend will end."
"Then you admit that gays don't have sex with animals?"
"You brought that up," I reminded him. "I have no information on the point. I'm only suggesting that not all 'orientations' are morally equivalent."
He said nothing, but showed no inclination to leave. "Do you think all 'orientations' are morally equivalent?" I queried.
"I won't even dignify that question with an answer," he said. "But I know what you think of my orientation. I'm sick of you phony Christians with your filthy hypocrisy about the love of God."
"So you've heard that I'm a Christian."
"Who hasn't? The holy, the sanctimonious, the Most Excellent Professor Theophilus of Post-Everything State University — what else would he be? The whole school reeks of you, of you and the other so-called Christian so-called professors. That's why I walked in on your Q&A. I wanted to see you spit venom."
"My goodness. Have I said anything venomous?"
"It's what you're thinking that's venomous."
"I see," I smiled. "Why don't you stop being bashful, and tell me what's bothering you?"
"You must think you're funny."
"I'm serious. Tell your complaints one by one, and I'll answer them."
"You couldn't answer them. I have too many."
"Try me. I'll give short answers."
He cocked his head and peered at me. "You mean it, don't you?"
"I wouldn't say it if I didn't."
"One at a time?"
"One at a time."
"All right, here's the first. Christians are hypocrites. You're always running down gays, but what about the other things your Bible condemns, like divorce and remarriage? It's other people's sins that bother you, not your own."
I laughed. "If you'd spent any time around me, you'd know that I'm just as hard on the sins of heterosexuals as on those of homosexuals. Easy divorce is a prime example of how one bad thing leads to another — in our case the loss of the ability to make any distinctions about sexual acts at all."
Ignoring the reply, he went on to his next complaint. "You're intolerant. You reject people like me just because we're different than you."
"Me reject you?" I said. "Aren't you the one who rejects what is different than yourself? Don't you reject the challenge of the other sex?"
"I don't need the other sex. I have a committed relationship with my partner."
"Research shows that homosexuals with partners don't stop cruising, they just cruise less. When they don't think straights are listening, gay writers say the same."
"So what if it's true? There's nothing wrong with gay love anyway."
I spoke quietly. "Tell me what's loving about sex acts that cause bleeding, choking, disease and pain," I suggested. "You might start by explaining the meaning of the medical term 'Gay Bowel Syndrome,' or how people get herpes lesions on their tonsils."
"You're — how can you even say that?" he demanded. "How dare you tell me who to love?"
"I don't think I am telling you who to love."
"Oh, no? Then what are you telling me?"
"That there is nothing loving about mutual self-destruction."
"You must think my relationship with my partner is just dirt!"
"No, I respect friendship wherever I find it — your friendship with your partner included. It's just that sex doesn't make every kind of friendship better."
"Why not? Are you anti-sex or something?"
"Not at all," I said, "but would you say that sex improves the friendship of a father with his daughter?"
Seeing from his face that he didn't, I continued. "You get my point. Nor does sex improve the friendship of two men."
"That's where you're wrong. Gay sex is just as natural for some people as straight sex is for other people."
"What's 'natural'," I said, "is what unlocks our inbuilt potential instead of thwarting it. One of the purposes of marital sex is to get you outside your Self and its concerns, to achieve intimacy with someone who is Really Other."
Was he listening to any of this? "I'm sorry, Lawrence — I really am — but having sex with another man can't do that. It's too much like loving your reflection. That's what I meant before about refusing the challenge of the other sex."
I was about to go on, but abruptly he changed the subject: "It's attitudes like yours that killed Matthew Shepard."
"Surely you don't imagine that the thugs who killed Matthew Shepard were Christians, do you?" I smiled at the absurdity of the thought, but seeing that he misunderstood my smile I made my face serious and tried again.
"Lawrence, I deplore the violence that killed Matthew Shepard, and I'm glad those men were caught. But shouldn't we also grieve the urge which caused Matthew Shepard to be sexually attracted to violent strangers?"
He said only, "You hate me."
I paused to study him. Did he really believe that, or was it a smokescreen?
"I don't hate you," I said. "I love you." I paused. "I'd like to be with you forever, in heaven."
Lawrence's face displayed shock, as though he had been hit in the stomach. Then he looked confused. The expression of confusion was instantaneously replaced by an expression of anger.
For one split-second, it had looked as if the shutters were open. "God in heaven," I thought, "I need help." How could they be pried back up?
"My love isn't really the issue for you, is it?" I asked.
"What do you mean?"
"It's God's. God's love is the issue for you." For a few seconds there was no reaction.
Then it came. "You're bleeping right God's love is the issue for me," he said. "Your God's love. The lying God who says He loves man, but who hates me for loving men."
"Do you think God hates you?"
"Doesn't He?"
"What makes you say that?"
"Doesn't your Bible say that? It calls people like me an abomination."
"It calls what you do abomination. There's a difference."
"There's no difference. I do what I am."
I considered his point. "Could it be," I said, "that you want God to love you less?"
"Less!" he spat.
"Yes. Don't you know what love is?"
"Acceptance."
"Acceptance of what kills you? Consider another view: Love is a commitment of the will to the true good of the other person."
"What?"
"I said love is a commitment of the will to the true good of the other person."
"I don't get what you're saying."
"Sure you do. The lover wants what's good for the beloved."
He hesitated. "I suppose."
"Good. Now think. If that's what love is, then a perfect Lover would want the perfect good of the Beloved. Do you see what that means? He would loath and detest whatever destroyed the beloved's good — no matter how much the beloved desired it."
I couldn't read the look on his face, so I plowed on. "That's what sin does — it destroys us. Yours destroys you, mine destroys me. And so the Lover doesn't 'accept' it; He hates it with an inexorable hatred. To cut the cancer out of us, He will do whatever it takes — like a surgeon. No, more than like a surgeon. If you let Him, He will even take the cancer upon Himself and die in your place."
Still inscrutable, he kept his eyes in front of him, just avoiding my own.
I asked "What happens, then, if you refuse to let go of what destroys you? What happens if you say this to the divine and perfect Lover who wants your complete and perfect good — if you say, 'I bind myself to my destruction! Accept me, and my destruction with me! I refuse to enter heaven except in the company of Death!"
Neither of us spoke.
Lawrence rose from his chair and walked out the door.

What scares and amazes me the most about the revisionists including Bp. Katy is that they ( or at least some of them ) apparently deep in their hearts believe this drivle. These people are wacked-out to the nth degree. They are not privy to a higher enlightenment. It's not about a "higher criticism" but rather rejection of the true faith.

Nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing in this world surprises me anymore. It's sad the church is not a rock that people can rely on to rescue them.

Satan had a field day this last week. Sad to say.

Gregory,
I love reading Professor Theophilus . Thank you for the reminder to go back to his site and see what is new.

Peace to you
Carol

Carol, thank you for responding and reading between the lines concerning my post.

HERE IS SOME MORE INFO AND LINKS FOR EVERYONE;


J. Budziszewski — a.k.a. "Professor Theophilus" — is here to help you tackle the tough issues.

Part advisor, part mentor, the Professor puts things in perspective and explains how your worldview underwrites not only your lifestyle, but also the decisions you make.




http://www.boundless.org/common/authorlist.cfm?aid=jb


http://www.boundless.org/2000/departments/your_turn/a0000245.html

http://www.trueu.org/library/libracademics/ProfsOffice/OfficeHours/index.cfm


AND REMEMBER THIS LINK:

http://www.exodus.to/component/option,com_frontpage/Itemid,1/


humbly, gregory

Thanks Gregory . . .

I read the interview between Lawrence and the Prof. just now.

I was riveted!

But, I am out of time.
God bless!

Gregory,
Many thanks for the new links.
Peace
Carol

Ya'll are very welcome. All i was doing was returning the favor of the links both of you (& other followers of Christ) have provided me and my wife.

You are not a Christian, feetxxxl.

If you were then you would accept Christ's teachings on sin, confession and repentance.

Your belief, and that of those other homosexual activists who have taken over ECUSA/TEC, is the calling of Satan's will. Therefore the instruction in 1Cor 5:9-13 applies.

You continue to defile the pages of this web site, feetxxxl, with your doctrinal exposition of the "right of orgasm".

Confess and repent of your sin. Scripture teaches that repentance and confession is required before God grants forgiveness. That Jesus Christ personally reproves the believer:

Revelations 3:19 “Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; be zealous therefore, and repent.”

Scripture also commands believers to be unconditionally forgiving.

Matthew 18:21,22 “Then Peter came and said to Him, ‘Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?’ Jesus said to him, ‘I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.’”

Yet personal repentance and confession are conditions before forgiveness is given by God.
John 1:9 “If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us of all unrighteousness.”

But these instruction cannot apply to you,feetxxxl, and those like you that have taken over ECUSA/TC -- the Spong generation. Your testimony is Satan's and the admonition in 5:13b applies, "REMOVE THE WICKED MAN FROM AMONG YOURSELVES."

Quote:

Here is a site on Dame Julian. She is refered to as a 14th century mystic.

If I'm not mistaken there was a resurgance of Christian Gnostisim at that time which she was probably influenced by.

http://www.luminarium.org/medlit/julian.htm