GC2006 : COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion
COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion
The Episcopal Church chooses to walk apart from the Anglican Communion
News Analysis
By Peter Toon
www.virtueonline.org
6/20/2006
In one hour of work by the House of Deputies on Tuesday afternoon, there was a double triumph for the New Episcopal Religion, and a double punch in the face of the Anglican Communion of Churches.
First of all, two major requests of The Windsor Report were refused. The Resolution, which urged the cessation of the consecration of actively homosexual persons and of the blessing of same-sex couples, (but which also apologized to the Lesbian and Gay people of the pain they feel) was clearly defeated and thus it was not sent on to the House of Bishops. It is apparently dead - "apparently" because the House of Bishops could possibly revive this matter of the two moratoriums (on bishops and same-sex couples).
In the second place, the House decided to vote in favor of approving the election of Barry L. Beisner as the next Bishop of Northern California. This now goes to the House of Bishops for their approval or rejection. The significance of this approval is immense because, despite "A Minority Report" from the examining Committee recommending rejection because of his complex marital status, the House approved a man for bishop, who is thrice married and twice divorced, and married presently to a divorced woman.
So in the big, wide world, and in the Anglican Communion of Churches, the Episcopal Church will be seen, on this evidence, as the Church which has entered deeply - in fact is "living into" - modern sexuality where there is space for not only serial monogamy but also for same-sex relations. Further, this Church has declared that it is prepared to stay in, what is familiarly called, "the Windsor process," only on its own terms. That is, this province will not walk in line with the other provinces but will walk on the other side of the road and alone, unless the Anglican Church of Canada decides to join it soon.
To all observers of this General Convention, it is obvious that there is within the Episcopal Church a majority which is committed to the whole of the New Episcopal Religion. This Religion bases its ethics on the Christian tradition as that is interpreted and perfected through the prism of modern human rights claims. The effects of this are various, from accepting the ordination of women to the blessing of same-sex couples..
This Religion is also deeply affected also by therapeutic and psychological descriptions of human nature, so that there is great emphasis on self-worth, self-fulfillment and self-realization. Everyone is to love one another, respecting the identity and "orientation" of each one, and recognizing that the expression of human love is actually the presence of God as love. Thus in terms of the identity of God, it emphasizes the presence of God in and through the created world and within human life to affirm each one, "just as he or she is." Thus it tends to embrace pantheism or panentheism (i.e., the cosmos is included in God) or even process theology (i.e., God is, with the world, in the process of evolution).
To understand the essential nature and character of this Religion, and just how much it has moved away from the historic, biblical Anglican Way is to begin to see why the majority in the Episcopal Church desires to walk alone from the Anglican Communion, unless that Communion accepts the terms of the New Episcopal Religion.
Sooner or later those who hold to the traditional Episcopal Religion will have to decide whether they to remain with the dominant majority who embrace the New Religion, or to find a way to live in such a way as to be in communion with orthodox Anglican Churches overseas. One "orthodox" Bishop, John W. Howe of Central Florida, has already stated his commitment to the Episcopal Church as it now is, by saying that he voted for the new Presiding Bishop, and is inviting her to his diocese. What decisions will the other "orthodox" Bishops take? We must give them time to ponder and pray and not press them to act hastily.
END
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| Poster | Thread |
|---|---|
| IMGB007 | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:03 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:03 |
Just can't stay away   Joined: 2006/6/15 From: Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 93 |
 Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal ReligionQuote:
What decisions will the other "orthodox" Bishops take? We must give them time to ponder and pray and not press them to act hastily. With all due respect, they've had THREE YEARS to ponder and pray!! Either lead us out of this heretic organization, or we'll go on our own. |
| DanielPaul | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:03 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:03 |
Just popping in   Joined: 2006/6/19 From: Posts: 2 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Those of us who are orthodox have prayed for clarity, and God has heard our prayers. ECUSA has never been more clear about their beliefs (or lack thereof) and their hubris in impacting the lives of other Christians, especially those within the Anglican Communion.
They have made it clear they choose to "walk apart", and I am hopeful the Anglican Communion primates will allow them to do so. |
| Anglophile | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:06 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:06 |
Just can't stay away Joined: 2005/7/6 From: Rochester,NY Posts: 149 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion I had higher hopes for Bishop Howe. I am not that suprised as he had been backing away recently and softening his stance. Oh well it will be the Bishop Ikers who stand for up for the true and old Church. The Bible based seem to have no problem with women clergy and the downward slide they started. I hope they are all happy together. Who will cave in next? Empty promised were made and us lay people were foolish to be taken in.
 |
| HowieG | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:06 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:06 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/7/1 From: Central Massachusetts Posts: 231 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion I posted this the other day. But as the GC06 continues, it becomes more obvious, the Episcopal Church is not interested in staying in the Anglican Communion.
Mourn and weep, for the body of my Son is broken. Mourn and weep, for the body of my Son is broken. Come before me with hearts and contrite spirits, for the body of my Son is broken. Come before me with sackcloth and ashes, Come before me with tears and mourning, for the body of my Son is broken. I would have made you one new man, but the body of my Son is broken. I would have made you a light on a mountaintop, A city glorious and splendorous that all the world would have seen, but the body of my Son is broken. The light is dim, My people are scattered, the body of my Son is broken. I gave all I had In the body and blood of my Son; It spilled on the earth, the body of my Son is broken. Turn from the sins of your fathers And walk in the ways of my Son. Return to the plan of your Father, Return to the purpose of your God; the body of my Son is broken. Mourn and weep, for the body of my Son is broken. (1977 Conference on the Holy Spirit). Substitute "the Body of my Son" with "The Episcopal Church". I wish we could a list of the actual votes. |
| freezion | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:18 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:18 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/8 From: Posts: 2 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion This is my first post, so bare with me. I left the episcopla church about 2 years ago. I attended the last conferance, takeing a group of teenagers to the convension in Minn. After confering with my priest who also attended the convention, annd voted for the ordanation of Gene Robinson, I knew I was no longer wecome as one who believes that the Bible is God's word and that we should live by what is said in it, that it is not a book of suggestions. It pains me greatly because there isn't an anglican church close by, so my family attends a non denominational church. I can tell you that the experiance of my then teenage daughter and I at the 03 convention was when people found out that we were against the ordination of Robinson we were treated as pariha. When I see what is going on currently with the epusa, I know that we made the right decission. I pray that teh African Bishops do indeed pick up the dioceses that are wanting to leave. We are planing to move to Florida in 6-12 months, and am wondering if anyone knows a good Anglican church in the Palm Coast area. Thanks Pax Christo
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| Cennydd | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:21 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:25 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/10/30 From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 6684 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion IMGB007, I agree that the orthodox bishops should proceed cautiously, but firmly, on course to take their dioceses out of ECUSA and into union with another province until a new orthodox Anglican province is created. In that light, I have been urging the creation of such a province in the U.S. for three years....with the Network and our Global Mission Patrners as a framework, since it's already set up and ready to function.
Cennydd |
| HowieG | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:27 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:28 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/7/1 From: Central Massachusetts Posts: 231 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Welcome Freezion!!
Please join the rest of us in mourning. Perhaps it is time for all of us to shake the dust off our feet and move on to Holy Ground. |
| dannyiseli | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:34 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:34 |
Not too shy to talk  Joined: 2006/6/18 From: new jersey Posts: 30 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion To your tents, O Anglicana! Maybe it's time to think about setting up a rival pension fund!!!! I'm sure this is the reason many clergy are prevaricating! My pledge is hereby put on hold!!!
Vote with your checkbooks, faithful Episcopalians. It's the best persuasion other than a bolt from heaven. |
| dannyiseli | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:35 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:35 |
Not too shy to talk Joined: 2006/6/18 From: new jersey Posts: 30 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion To your tents, O Anglicana! Maybe it's time to think about setting up a rival pension fund!!!! I'm sure this is the reason many clergy are prevaricating! My pledge is hereby put on hold!!!
Vote with your checkbooks, faithful Episcopalians. It's the best persuasion other than a bolt from heaven. |
| rossi | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:42 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:48 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/6/18 From: Redcar, England Posts: 639 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Ooooh my Gaad! this is getting better and better.
I just want to see the reaction of Our Universal pastor The Most Reverend Akinola.I don't think he will react with what this bastards heretics call G-d's love.I want to see what the stupid and idiot Ronan Cantuar will say tomorow.He will need to have a idea about how to clean all these poo.How stupid people are,they had hope that the heretics of the TEC would regret and repent of their sinful actions.And how orthodox is the bishop of Central Florida.He said more the one time if the now TEC decide to walk out of the Ang. Com. he would choose the Ang.Com.Hove words have the same value as dogs poo |
| ejsteele | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:43 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:43 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2004/10/18 From: Posts: 347 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Well it appears that the end has come, so will the last true Anglican please grab the Presence light on your way out?
+EJ |
| IMGB007 | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:51 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:51 |
Just can't stay away Joined: 2006/6/15 From: Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin Posts: 93 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Cennydd, thanks for your words. I spoke (wrote) from the reaction of my heart. I know our orthodox leaders need to proceed with caution. I can live (and stay) with knowing that they are actively moving towards not being affiliated with the episcobaalian pagans. But, as you say, the proceeding should be done "firmly". I'd like to hear that they have plans and are moving toward making them happen. I was very happy for the diocese of Ft. Worth to see that Bp. Iker has asked for alternate primatial oversight. That to me shows action and a plan to disassociate from our national heretics, as opposed to a "let's wait and see for another three years" non-action.
I'm just frustrated, I guess. My desire is for our own beloved bishop to lead us out (which I think he'll do). I'll follow him. I met him before I became an Episcopalian, and he impressed me more than words can say. He's proven himself to be a good and faithful shepherd of the flock that God has given him to watch over. God bless, Greg |
| hobbit | Posted: 2006/6/20 21:53 Updated: 2006/6/20 21:53 |
Just can't stay away Joined: 2005/3/1 From: ireland Posts: 122 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Presence Light - no such thing in all but maybe 1 0r 2 Anglican churches in Ireland my friend.
ECUSA will continue and it will continue to spread its alternative gospel and threaten to withdraw financial support to things like the ACC - and watch the spineless ones bow before the god of mammon. it is time to say we did not leave - you left the faith. my only surprise is that it has taken so long for people to leave. hobbit. |
| 2cents | Posted: 2006/6/20 22:11 Updated: 2006/6/20 22:11 |
Just popping in Joined: 2005/10/9 From: Posts: 9 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion "Sooner or later those who hold to the traditional Episcopal Religion will have to decide whether they to remain with the dominant majority who embrace the New Religion, or to find a way to live in such a way as to be in communion with orthodox Anglican Churches overseas."
Sooner or later? Puh-leez. The ECUSA has tolerated heresy, the unscriptural ordination of women, the ordination of a non-celibate gay bishop and only now are people wringing their hands? And some of the traditionalists are still trying to find a compromise? Why - because they don't want to give up the property? If a traditionalist bishop has ordained a women priest, he is complicit in the state the church finds itself in now. The traditionalists need to stand up to their bishops and say, "lead, follow or get out of the way." The laity can vote with its feet or its purse. Sometimes situations get so bad, so beyond repair that you have to just start over. The ECUSA has become a refuge for liturgical unitarians, bleeding hearts, disaffected liberal Roman Catholics and church queens. "Sooner or later those who hold to the traditional Episcopal Religion will have to decide..." The ECUSA has chosen its path, who will follow, who will leave, and who will wait and see? The verse about blowing neither hot nor cold comes to mind... |
| 2cents | Posted: 2006/6/20 22:13 Updated: 2006/6/20 22:14 |
Just popping in Joined: 2005/10/9 From: Posts: 9 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Duplicate post, sorry.
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| Funkels | Posted: 2006/6/20 23:06 Updated: 2006/6/20 23:06 |
Just popping in Joined: 2004/5/4 From: Posts: 16 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion I just have to wonder why the orthodox have hung on for so long? I left over a year ago and based on what I see reported at this convention, I made the right decision.
Do you think much of this still comes down to property? I guess it is hard to walk away. Funkels |
| john4woman | Posted: 2006/6/20 23:56 Updated: 2006/6/20 23:56 |
Just can't stay away Joined: 2006/5/28 From: california Posts: 104 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion The new episcopal church must not fear the wrath of the Lord...as a refugee from the secular humanist world of psychology, I accepted Christ and joined the Church because I finally learned that there is only God's Truth. Now my Church has left God's Truth for the false god of the state and a gospel of social justice as opposed to the Good News of Redemption...
May God have Mercy on us all... |
| yaya2 | Posted: 2006/6/21 0:07 Updated: 2006/6/21 0:07 |
Not too shy to talk Joined: 2006/6/12 From: Arkansas Posts: 29 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion john4woman.......God knows your heart! Thank God you saw the light of Christ. It is all around you! That light may have gone out in ECUSA, but it is His light you truly need and it will always be there........take heart and pray!!
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| spbarrett | Posted: 2006/6/21 0:08 Updated: 2006/6/21 0:08 |
Just popping in  Joined: 2006/6/19 From: Hippie Valley, W. Mass. Posts: 17 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Didn't then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger warn about a "dictatorship of relativism" before he became Pope Benedict XVI?
Look at what's happening now! A dictatorship of mediocrities leading a flock of brainless sheep to Satan's slaughterhouse. Hooray for Bishop Ikers. I only wish Rome had more men like him. (I bet Benedict does too.) |
| MichaelA | Posted: 2006/6/21 1:12 Updated: 2006/6/21 1:12 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/5/29 From: Posts: 869 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Friends,
Christo (aka Freezion) has asked: "We are planing to move to Florida in 6-12 months, and am wondering if anyone knows a good Anglican church in the Palm Coast area. Thanks Pax Christo" Is anyone able to help Christo and his family with information about good churches in that area? This is so important - every Anglican who is led into fellowship with other faithful Anglicans, instead of living by themselves in despair, hurts the devil plans. |
| Gideon_FL | Posted: 2006/6/21 1:18 Updated: 2006/6/21 1:18 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/8/25 From: SW FL Posts: 169 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Funkels asks: "Do you think much of this still comes down to property?"
Well, that's an oversimplification. As I've posted on another thread, I think there are two difficult barriers. One is "property", if by that you mean our families graves and their sacrifices over generations to build a space to worship God, and where so many of our family's cherished events have taken place. But a close second is the fear of being complicit in the use of all those assets in a new pagan cult of humanism and sodomy and abortion worship. If we don't fight to keep the assets, we fear they'll be used by the powers of darkness. So, it's not just idolatry or an unwilligness to walk out into the desert to be delivered. It's a faith struggle between two truly unpleasant alternatives; the lesser of two evils. Faithfully, Gideon |
| daverad | Posted: 2006/6/21 1:42 Updated: 2006/6/21 1:42 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/21 From: Posts: 1 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion I would like to comment on Bishop Howe. I belong to an orthodox parish in the Central Florida Diocese and have had the opportunity to meet and speak with Bishop Howe personally. I was also an alternate lay-delegate for the Central Florida Diocese convention and attended it earlier this year. Bishop Howe called for a special convention earlier this year for our diocese to be held in September to react to the decisions of the GC. (He did this knowing that it would be neccessary.)Please do not be so quick to judge Bishop Howe. I know him to be very thoughtful and scripturally based in his theology. He said at our 2006 diocesan convention "I reiterate to you today that I have no intention of breaking away from the Episcopal Church. But, as I have also told you before, if it breaks away from the Anglican Communion it breaks away from me. That is the only place I know where to stand."
I believe him. DJM |
| Doogie777 | Posted: 2006/6/21 2:18 Updated: 2006/6/21 20:27 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/20 From: Posts: 4 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion There is NOTHING new about this religion - baal worship has been around for a long time.
It is so completely unbelievable to see mass deception on such a large scale.
Lord, have mercy.
Christ have mercy.
Lord, have mercy.
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| MichaelA | Posted: 2006/6/21 2:22 Updated: 2006/6/21 2:22 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/5/29 From: Posts: 869 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Okay, DaveRad, are you able to assist Freezion with some information about faithful bible-believing Anglican churches in the area of Florida that he and his family will move to?
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| erennach | Posted: 2006/6/21 4:20 Updated: 2006/6/21 4:20 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/17 From: Tennessee Mountains Posts: 9 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Gideon you speak wisely. Both points are important and need to be addressed. The properties (land, churches, etc) represent not only cherished memories, but much sacrifice ('blood, sweat, toil and tears')never mind the dollars & cents worth.
What the bad guys want is not only control of the financial and physical resources that the faithful created (and replacing those facilities will take precious financial resources and time), but the mantle of legitimacy/authenticity that such control conveys. The University of the South in Sewanee TN is a perfect case in point. The seminary there turns out not believers and servants of Jesus Christ, but priests who are basically 'liturgical Unitarians' at best (description by another poster) and New Age pagan priests at worst. I've heard Episcopalians up there call those who did not share their New Age world view but were committed to the Scriptures and an orthodox theology 'uneducated". St. Paul's epistles were only 'his opinions', not the Word of God. These are the people in control of the facilities and bank account of an old and venerable institution. In wondering if faithful Anglicans should fight for the churches and bank accounts: let me paraphrase: gaining the property isn't worth losing your souls... |
| CalAggie | Posted: 2006/6/21 5:29 Updated: 2006/6/21 5:49 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2006/4/9 From: Davis, CA Posts: 156 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion After praying and meditating for a while this evening, I have finally decided I am no longer an Episcopalian, and the Episcopal Church at the National Level is apostate and moving toward Christian Heresy. Now I must decide what to do. I'm going to Italy in about a week for a "family vacation", perhaps I will submit to Rome and the papacy. My question to you all is... Will Anglicanism be forever plagued by apostasy like the ECUSA? Can Anglidom be stand firm in the face of social change? If not... then I suppose Rome is the true church...
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| MichaelA | Posted: 2006/6/21 5:30 Updated: 2006/6/21 5:30 |
Home away from home Joined: 2006/5/29 From: Posts: 869 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Erennach, you raise a good point: The seminaries.
It is so important that the new Anglican church in America have its seminaries firmly under the control of godly and scriptural believers. All Anglicans, whether laity or clergy, should continually demand that their churches continually scrutinise the teaching and faculty of their seminary. This will particularly be important when, as I predict, the various faithful Anglican groups start to coalesce into larger groupings over the next few years. Regards Michael |
| Anonymous | Posted: 2006/6/21 6:15 Updated: 2006/6/21 6:29 |
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Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Daverad wrote:
Please do not be so quick to judge Bishop Howe. I know him to be very thoughtful and scripturally based in his theology. He said at our 2006 diocesan convention "I reiterate to you today that I have no intention of breaking away from the Episcopal Church. But, as I have also told you before, if it breaks away from the Anglican Communion it breaks away from me. That is the only place I know where to stand." ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND? BISHOP HOWE IS A LIAR !!!! I TOLD YOU PEOPLE YEARS AGO ON THIS VERY BLOG THAT BISHOP HOWE IS NO ORTHODOX. I LEFT ALL SOULS IN JACKONSONVILLE, FL BECAUSE OUR RECTOR REFUSED TO BELIEVE ME, DURING A MEETING RIGHT AFTER THE ROBINSON DISASTER, NOT TO TRUST THE WORDS OF BISHOP DUNCAN BUT LISTEN TO WHAT THE REAL "ORTHODOX VOICE" WAS IN THE PERSON OF HOWE. WHEN I CONFRONTED MY PASTOR WITH A QUOTE FROM HOWE IN WHICH HE DIRECTLY CONTRADICTED BOTH DUNCAN, THE ACN AND MY PASTOR'S VIEW THAT THE ACN WOULD BE A CHURCH WITHIN A CHURCH, WOULD BECOME THE NEW RECOGNIZED PROVINCE OF ANGLICANISM IN THE STATES AND WOULD PROVIDE SAFE-HAVEN FOR ORTHODOX PARISHES, HOWE STATED FLATLY, NO !!!! I THEN ASKED MY PASTOR TO THE ASTONISHMENT, GASPS AND MURMURS AMONGST MY PARISHONERS, "SO, WHICH ONE OF YOU IS TELLING THE TRUTH?" TO WIT, MY PASTOR SAID WEAKLY THAT HOWE MIGHT BE SAYING THAT FOR POLITICAL REASONS. I KNEW THEN THAT WAS BULLCRAP!!!!! HOWE IS TYPICAL OF THE ORTHODOX WHO HAVE LET THE PAGAN WOLVES DESTROY THIS CHURCH. BUT NOOOOOOOO.......MANY OF YOU EXCORIATED ME FOR MY HARSH RECTORIC ABOUT HOWE. YOU TOLD ME HOW ORTHODOX HE WAS....HOW HE WOULD LEAVE WHEN IT BECAME EVIDENT THAT ECUSA WAS A LOST CAUSE. BULLCRAP.....BULLCRAP.....BULLCRAP. THE BASTARD BISHOP HOWE IS A LIAR !!! AND NOT ONLY THAT, HE IS A BASTARD BISHOP OF THE DEATH CULT USA. HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP.....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE? HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP WHO BELIEVES IN THE GOD CREATED AND GOD ORDAINED RIGHT FOR A MAN TO ABUSE ANOTHER MAN'S ANUS WITH HIS PENIS AND CALL IT HOLY.....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE? HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP WHO BELIEVES THAT THE BIBLE IS OPPRESSIVE AND ANTI-JEWISH....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE? HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP WHO BELIEVES THAT A WOMAN HAS THE RIGHT TO MURDER HER CHILD IN THE WOMB.....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE. HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP WHO IS LEADING THIS CHURCH AT THIS VERY MOMENT AWAY FROM THE ANGLICAN COMMUNION, YET HOWE REMAINS EVEN THOUGH HE SAID HE WOULD NOT, MAKING HIM AN UNREPENTENT LIAR.....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE? I TOLD YOU ALL THAT SCHORI WAS THE SHOE-IN CHOICE OF ECUSA.....I TOLD YOU ALL 3 YEARS AGO NOT TO TRUST THE ORTHODOX AS REPRESENTED BY HOWE. MANY OF YOU BELIEVED ME.....MOST OF YOU DID NOT.......WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO WAKE UP AND REALIZE THAT I KNOW THESE THINGS BECAUSE I KNOW THAT GOD ALMIGHTY HIMSELF HAS COMPLETELY GIVEN THESE PEOPLE OVER TO THEIR DELUSIONS AND THEY ARE COMPLETELY AND IRREVOCABLY CURSED. WHEN YOU UNDERSTAND THIS....IT BECOMES EASY TO PREDICT THESE THINGS BECAUSE ONCE GOD HAS THROWN YOU AWAY, THE VERY WORST OF THE HUMAN CONDITION COMES OUT. THINK THE WORST....IT WILL COME TRUE. ONCE AGAIN....READ BISHOP HOWE'S WORDS....."THE ACN IS NOT GOING TO BE THE NEW PROVINCE IN AMERICA....IT WILL NOT BE A CHURCH WITHIN A CHURCH." "I WILL NEVER LEAVE ECUSA....BUT IF ECUSA LEAVES THEN I WILL NOT FOLLOW." NOW LOOK AT HIS ACTIONS......HE VOTED FOR THE FIRST FEMALE BISHOP IN THE HISTORY OF THE CHURCH......THIS WOMAN BELIEVES IN THE SANCTITY OF SODOMY...SHE BELIEVES IN THE RIGHT OF WOMAN TO SLAUGHTER THEIR CHILDREN IN THE WOMB.....HE VOTED FOR HER AND IS INVITING THIS WITCH TO HIS DIOCESE AND HIS CHURCH. LIAR !!!! LIAR !!!!! LIAR !!!!! |
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| ahauber | Posted: 2006/6/21 8:33 Updated: 2006/6/21 8:35 |
Just can't stay away  Joined: 2006/3/5 From: Georgia Posts: 149 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Rootbranch,
Gee, I guess you feel kind of strongly on this issue. Such tactics as these are becomming familiar as fence-sitting bishops weave words of pluriform truths to placate any who raise questions, while they work behind the scenes to bring in their 'new religeon.' As you know, we've seen it here in GA, also. As conservatives, we are particularly susceptible to this tactic and have often been played for the fool. The conservative mind, by its nature, wants to trust in systems and processes, and attribute to those higher orders honor and trust that has not been earned. This is our weakness of which we need to be watchful. Andy |
| ZachD | Posted: 2006/6/21 16:14 Updated: 2006/6/21 16:14 |
Home away from home  Joined: 2005/11/10 From: Posts: 1782 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Rootbranch,
How's the blood pressure? First off, I value your facts and your passion. Thank you. Considering the 'facts' of +Howe's voting record (I have only your passioned statements, which is OK by me.), our ONLY alternative is to forge alignments with a true leader, IMMEDIETELY! Form a worldly perspective, this is a club, lets not forget that! These people are panic'd and fearful, even if SOME OF THE BONES IN THEIR BODIES are orthodox! Honestly, they are being sanctified as we all are. They need our encouragement, help and support, and oft times a real hard kick in the ecclesial pants to wake them! I am too far from this picture to offer more. Godspeed, Rootbranch. |
| why1914 | Posted: 2006/6/21 16:29 Updated: 2006/6/21 16:29 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/21 From: Posts: 3 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion apparently, howe did NOT vote for her, and is now 'dis-inviting' her to central florida.
http://lobsterhouse.blogspot.com/2006/06/from-bishop-john-howeposted-with.html What he will do, who knows? But it is time for something other then words so we will see shortly. |
| Anonymous | Posted: 2006/6/21 17:33 Updated: 2006/6/21 17:33 |
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Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Interesting......
So let's assume Howe is telling the truth and Father Toon got it wrong on the vote...Howe's own words from his own post show that like most politicians he didn't know much about the person he says he did not vote for. He did not know that Schori had allowed gays to marry...regardless of what she was calling it. Howe himself even said he finds it amazing that anyone would question why he is giving his support to the new Presiding Priestess, even though she supports and voted for Robinson, supports gay marriage, supports infanticide, supports Griswold's pluriform truths instead of the Bible. So he didn't vote for her....so what? He said himself he supports her. That's tatamount to giving "aid and comfort" to the enemy. And that means he is the enemy as well. |
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| Anonymous | Posted: 2006/6/21 17:35 Updated: 2006/6/21 17:35 |
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Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion CalAggie said "I'm going to Italy in about a week for a "family vacation", perhaps I will submit to Rome and the papacy. My question to you all is... Will Anglicanism be forever plagued by apostasy like the ECUSA? Can Anglidom be stand firm in the face of social change? If not... then I suppose Rome is the true church..."
******* Dear CalAggie Three weeks ago I took a trip to Rome and spent 5 days. I throughly loved it and saw a church that was still alive and doing well. There is much to see in Rome so be prepared for long lineups and beauty all around  . On your question, I maintain that Anglicanism will continue to divide and realign. It is the flaw of protestantism coming to fruit for the Anglicans in 2006. Without authority in todays secular and liberal world, I believe it will eventually die a slow death centainly in the West. If you wish to learn more about Rome see www.catholic.com for many answers to your questions and for Orthodoxy please PM DnNeal a regular poster. I can also supply you with more links if you desire and tell you what to go look for in Rome. God Bless BHTech |
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| ZachD | Posted: 2006/6/21 19:24 Updated: 2006/6/21 19:30 |
Home away from home Joined: 2005/11/10 From: Posts: 1782 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion "HE VOTED FOR A FEMALE PRESIDING BISHOP.....HOW ORTHODOX CAN HE BE?"
"So he didn't vote for her, so what?" ______________________________________________ Rootbranch: If you must rant and rave, get the facts straight, will you? Do you know what LIBEL is? Additionally, we need to keep our heads in this slippery slope. What we say has impact, man! Let us be responsible for stating truth, not falsehood. Blessings . . . With thanks, why1914. |
| why1914 | Posted: 2006/6/21 20:12 Updated: 2006/6/21 20:12 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/21 From: Posts: 3 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Your welcome. At times like these, people are going to rant and rave ... I am not saying rootbranch was right or wrong in either the substance of the reply or in ranting/raving, just that it is a normal reaction to these sorts of times.
My name, "why1914" is a tip-off to the fact that I grew up a Jehovah Witness... if you want to see real ranting and raving, check out an ex-jw board As I know first-hand, it's no fun to watch the church you grew up in, had childhood friends in, found the Lord in, possibly married in, funerals, etc, "suddenly" crumble before your eyes (or in my case, the illusion crumble). This is not a pleasant matter and everyone handles stress differently. Prayer is sometimes the only medicine we have. And it is sufficient. |
| Anonymous | Posted: 2006/6/21 23:06 Updated: 2006/6/21 23:07 |
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Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion ZachD wrote:
Rootbranch: If you must rant and rave, get the facts straight, will you? Granted...as well as Father Toon, it would seem. However, from Howe's own lips, he is supporting the Presiding Priestess who just spoke today about our mother Jesus. He says he supports the Presiding Priestess who believes in murdering children. He supports the Presiding Priestess who believes that God made men's anuses for sexual pleasure. That's not slander....it's the truth. |
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| Collin | Posted: 2006/7/7 15:04 Updated: 2006/7/7 15:04 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/30 From: Malaysia Posts: 15 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion Well, in case you didnt read between the lines, believing in Christ comes with social obligations. Jesus is a just Lord as well, and He would expect the same respect towards everyone and anyone.
For example, I do not believe in ordaining gays to the priesthood and I certainly do not condone homosexual activity but rest be assured, the homosexuals are still welcome to sit in any pew to pray, attend Mass, and be part of the community. A disagreement with the way one chooses to lead his life should not be basis for an agreement. Jesus never judged and neither should we. A gospel of social justice is secondary and in fact, may be necessary, but it is not as important as the Good News of Redemption. |
| Collin | Posted: 2006/7/7 15:30 Updated: 2006/7/7 15:30 |
Just popping in Joined: 2006/6/30 From: Malaysia Posts: 15 |
Re: COLUMBUS, OH: The triumph of the New Episcopal Religion I was raised Roman Catholic and truth to be told, i could not agree with 2 things - Mary & the Saints and the Pope. It was not that I disagreed completely, but rather, I personally felt that the theology behind it was unbiblical and sad to say, "stupid".
1. I hold Mary in high regard. In this sense, like Elizabeth, we can "hail" her. She is the Mother of our Lord (provided for in the Gospels and the Council of Chaldecon, was "full of grace", and was blessed. In fact, all generations can call her "blessed". She is a great saint and example of faith to be reckoned with. However, Rome seems to have gotten a little too carried away with its unbiblical doctrines like the Assumption. By taking into account her faith and obedience to God, yes, she could have gone to heaven body and soul united but then again, since its not written or recorded anywhere (the only verifiable source is mystic Anne Catherine Emmerich's visions, which can be doubted as well), its merely private judgement. Take the "Hail, Holy Queen" prayer. Read it and tell me what you think. Is that proper devotion to Mary? Bullcrap. Next brings me to "praying" to them asking them to pray for us. Why do I need to pray to them? Can't I stand in front of a picture or statue, and say, "Mother Mary, please pray for me that I... " or "St. Joseph, please pray for me that I will be a good example like you" etc. The Romans have got it all wrong by saying "pray to St. Joseph and you will be a good carpenter". So, whats a good way of praying to the saints? see what the Bible says. I personally believe its ok to go through these saints but we are saints as well. We can pray for one another! And while we can pray directly to Jesus, a communion of saints is good as "2 or 3 gathered in My name, I am gathered in their midst" and that we will need all the intercession from the Church both on earth and in heaven! My theories on Mary and the saints differ from the Roman Church. This then brings me to the matter of the papacy. The Assumption was a doctrine pronouced with papal infallibility and since it was pronounced with papal infallibility, it is a sovereign and valid doctrine. For me, I hold the Pope in high regard as he is a great pastor. No one has ever addressed world issues in a Christian manner than John Paul II (soon with Benedict XVI) has. I disagree however, with the adulation that the Pope recieves. Why do we need to be obedient to him? The Bible says "submit to your elders" but what more? Why do we need to take his words as infallible? Is it that because he sits his ass on St. Peter's chair and sits under a glass-stained window depicting the Holy Spirit, he is infallible? I think not. He is a leader, a bishop, and a respected world figure. Nothing more. What irks me even more is the ego of the papacy. Who said that they are the one true Church?! Why does every other bishop need to bow down to the supremacy of the Pope?! He is the first among equals as bishops are all equal in spiritual and pastoral authority and nothing more than that. With all thats been said, I'd say think properly before going to Rome. God bless! Collin http://www.iccec.org |
