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News : Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome next year?
Posted by David Virtue on 2009/10/30 13:00:00 (1272 reads)

Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome next year?

by Avril Ormsby
http://tinyurl.com/yhz5apo
October 27th, 2009


The timing of the trips couldn't be more intriguing, especially the second one. The pope is due to visit Britain in September 2010 and is expected to preside there over the beatification of the late Cardinal John Henry Newman, a famous 19th-century convert from Anglicanism to Catholicism.

The queen is, after all, the Supreme Governor of the Church of England, many of whose flock the pope is seeking to poach with his offer last week allowing Anglicans to convert en masse while keeping many of their traditions. And among her honorifics is "Defender of the Faith." While that sounds impressive, it pales in comparison to Benedict's long string of titles including "Vicar of Jesus Christ, Successor of the Prince of the Apostles and Supreme Pontiff of the Universal Church." But oneupmanship is a British sport, so one never knows how these things can turn out.

It is unclear how many CofE traditionalists, upset at moves to ordain women bishops and the issue of homosexuality, will move over to Rome, but the conservative Anglican group Forward in Faith suggested 12 Church of England bishops may switch - more than a quarter of their total.

It was suggested by the Daily Telegraph newspaper earlier this month, before the Vatican effectively sabotaged decades of dialogue between the two churches, that the pope would receive a warm welcome at Buckingham Palace. "The warmth of her welcome will come as no surprise to the pontiff," it said.

Citing sources speaking to the Catholic Herald weekly, the Telegraph said the queen has "grown increasingly sympathetic" to the Roman Catholic Church over the years while being "appalled," along with her son and heir Charles, at developments in the Church of England.

The Sunday Telegraph in July said the queen had told the heads of a traditional group that she "understood their concerns" about the future of the 77 million-strong global church.

But whether the warmth will stand up to the pope parking his tanks on her lawn, as Ruth Gledhill described it in The Times - especially Buckingham Palace's lawns - would be astonishing.

As head of her faith she must defend her church, and can do so on an equal footing in both political and spiritual terms, Vicki Woods of the Telegraph wrote. "When Pope John Paul II met the queen on his visit to Britain, he was for once wrong-footed," she pointed out. "She spoke to him not as a fellow head of state but as a fellow head of the church: her church. Her faith. Which she defends. He was quite taken aback."

It is not only her church's clergy and laity which are up for grabs, but possibly also the buidlings.

And it was Queen Elizabeth I, after all, who so staunchly defended the English Reformation introduced by her father Henry VIII in 1534 in his dispute with Rome over his desire to divorce one wife and marry another.

The queen has already potentially been slighted by her Prime Minister Gordon Brown, who it has been reported in the media, apparently personally invited the pope to visit Britain during a private audience last February.

williams-hand"He should read Carla Powell's diary in The Spectator," Woods wrote. "Gordon Brown says he invited His Holiness, which if true would represent a gross breach of protocol. Only the queen can invite a head of state to Britain."

The queen, needless to say, has said even less than her archbishop. The older royals don't often leave themselves open to be quoted. On one of the rare occasions they have, the late queen mother was reported to have only commented that church services should not last beyond an hour. The archbishop has barely said much more in response to the pope other than he did not see it as "an act of aggression" and that it would not derail dialogue between the two churches.

But when you become the focus of general sympathy, you must know that you have probably been dealt a rum deal.

The fact that the archbishop was only notified two weeks before the pope revealed just how far he was prepared to go in accommodating the Anglo-Catholics must have left him "starting to wonder if he has any friends left," Gledhill wrote in the Times over the weekend. "He is like the academic boy at school who no one wants to play with because he doesn't understand the rules of fisticuffs," she added.

Many religious figures have been indignant at the way the Vatican has behaved towards Williams, with his predecessor George Carey urging him to protest at its "appalling" injustice.

The Vatican is expected to reveal more details about the offer in the next week or two. The conservative Anglican group Forward in Faith debated the offer in London at the weekend and decided its members would be consulted, with a decision due in late February after the CofE general synod.

threlfall-holmesSome women priests say that timing is cynical, based on emotional blackmail.

"It is beginning to sound like an abusive marriage," said the pro-women ordination spokeswoman Reverend Miranda Threlfall-Holmes, chaplain at University College, Durham, in northern England. She suggested the disaffected will threaten to leave unless concessions are made on the possible ordination of women bishops, which is due to be discussed at the synod.

The Vatican made moves 17 years ago to attract Anglicans when the ordination of women priests was being discussed. "They could say we will leave unless you do this and that," she said.

What do you think? Will Queen Elizabeth surprise Pope Benedict and defend the faith, as she did with Pope John Paul? Or will diplomacy prevail?

END

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Poster Thread
Cennydd
Posted: 2009/10/30 21:02  Updated: 2009/10/30 21:02
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/10/30
From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin
Posts: 6684
 Re: Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome nex...
Of course, I'm not one of Her Majesty's subjects, but I do admire her.

I do have relatives in Wales, though, and they tell me that they believe she takes her role as Supreme Governor and Head of the Church seriously.

Therefore, I think it is likely that she will exercise her authority in defending the faith.

Cennydd
Drummie
Posted: 2009/10/30 22:36  Updated: 2009/10/30 22:46
Home away from home
Joined: 2007/9/27
From:
Posts: 505
 Re: Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome nex...
It never fails to amaze me at how ignorant of the facts so many are on this topic. Who was it that approached who? The Archbishop of the TAC called out for help from Rome. The Holy Father did not go "after them", they approached him. Also, they were not in communion with Canterbury anyway.

Has anyone thought that if the Anglican Communion had not been imploding since at least the 1960's or even earlier, this would have never occured?

There has been enough venom passed over this by those who for whatever reason seem to hate the Pope. If the Latin Church was a business, they would be hailed as a great success. They are you know the largest church on the planet, so they must have a bit of an idea about Christianity. Let's get it right, the Pope did NOT park his tanks at Lambeth or Buckingham. Further, he did not torpedo relations with anyone. If anyone torpedoed anything, it was the TEC and the Church of England. They have taken it upon themselves to over turn what Christ started. Who said they had any right to over rule our Lord and Saviour on issues of the sanctity of life, authority of the Bible and ordination of women or gays? If people would take time to check the history of the Anglican Communion, they would find that at that time of the Reformation, the division between England and Rome was political and not doctrinal. Women's Ordination torpedoed any reunion with Rome. Since then, the Gay lobby and those so weak they would not stand up for Christ have caused the problem, not the Vatican.
Cennydd
Posted: 2009/10/31 0:05  Updated: 2009/10/31 0:05
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/10/30
From: Los Banos, CA, Anglican Diocese of San Joaquin
Posts: 6684
 Re: Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome nex...
Far be it from me to find fault with Benedict XVI and the Catholic Church's stand on these issues, since I agree with them.

You're right on the mark, Drummie!

Cennydd
blackshama
Posted: 2009/10/31 14:15  Updated: 2009/10/31 14:15
Quite a regular
Joined: 2009/7/10
From:
Posts: 50
 Re: Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome nex...
I wonder what Her Majesty as Defender of the Faith told His Holiness as Vicar of Christ? In 1982, did the Church of England need defending? From whom? Form the Protestant Episcopal Church of the USA which as early as then, had sowed the seeds of the Anglican Communion's destruction?
larsil
Posted: 2009/11/2 15:13  Updated: 2009/11/2 15:13
Home away from home
Joined: 2005/10/23
From: near Pittsburgh
Posts: 166
 Re: Will Queen Elizabeth give the pope a warm welcome nex...
I will affirm Her Majesty in her role as Defender of the Faith, for the Church of England. She is not Defender of the Faith for the entire Anglican Communion. (Although, I am more confident of her skills at that than I am of Charles... or possibly even of Rowan Cantuar!)

I continue to be impressed with Elizabeth II's grasp of the situation at hand, no matter what the situation is. She has served as monarch well, in a surprising number of ways. There is much to admire, even from a non-Royalist like me.

---L.
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